Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP

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Sujet : Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP
De : will.dockery (at) *nospam* gmail.com (W.Dockery)
Groupes : alt.arts.poetry.comments rec.arts.poems
Date : 04. Feb 2025, 19:54:14
Autres entêtes
Organisation : novaBBS
Message-ID : <4ab89696e57fd50c7db54c60c21cade1@www.novabbs.com>
References : 1
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George J. Dance wrote:

moved from
https://www.novabbs.com/arts/article-flat.php?id=254114&group=alt.arts.poetry.comments#254114
>
On Thu, 16 Jan 2025 0:20:56 +0000, W.Dockery wrote:
>
That's Michael Pendragon, always the Peter Keating styled second hander.
>
Essentially we're in agreement; but I have to raise two non-essential
points of disagreement. First, I would rather not refer to the subject
as "Pendragon." The subject's real name is unknown; "Michael Pendragon"
is just one of his socks, albeit the most prolific one. I would prefer
to refer to him as "MMP" (which doesn't mean you have to, of course, if
you disagree).
>
Second, I don't think that Peter Keating is the best 'type' to describe
MMP in the novel. Both Keating and MMP are social metaphysicians - they
think that reality is whatever people believe it is, the "consensus"
view of reality. But so do half the novel. Where those two are different
is that Keating is content to follow the consensus, while MMP believes
he can actually control reality by controlling others' beliefs. That
makes him more like two of Rand's other protagonists from that novel,
Gail Wynand and Ellsworth Toohey. Which of those matches him best is
still an open question.
>
Why does Michael Pendragon lie and misrepresent so much?
>
MMP has told us he was abused as a boy, and I think that fact is key.
Lying is one tactic children usually try at some point to escape
punishment, and an abused child has all the more reason to keep at it ad
learn how to do it successfully. Since MMP comes across as clever (at
least 120 IQ), it is also fair to think that he was able to learn to lie
successfully. So it is fair to conclude that he did learn to lie
successfully, and escape punishment, more than once.
>
While no one can blame a child in that position for lying, his doing so
successfully would be giving him the wrong feedback, making him think
that he actually was changing reality by changing his parents' beliefs -
telling him that in fact reality was whatever one wanted it to be, and
that he could be that one.
>
More later, but I wanted to get these two points on record quickly.
Great, that gives me time to brew a pot of coffee.
😏

Date Sujet#  Auteur
17 Jan 25 * The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP66George J. Dance
17 Jan 25 +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP26W.Dockery
1 Feb 25 i`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP25George J. Dance
1 Feb 25 i +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP8HarryLime
1 Feb 25 i i`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP7George J. Dance
1 Feb 25 i i +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
2 Feb 25 i i +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP4HarryLime
3 Feb 25 i i i`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP3George J. Dance
3 Feb 25 i i i +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
3 Feb 25 i i i `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1HarryLime
2 Feb 25 i i `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1HarryLime
1 Feb 25 i +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP15HarryLime
2 Feb 25 i i`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP14George J. Dance
2 Feb 25 i i +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
2 Feb 25 i i +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP11HarryLime
3 Feb 25 i i i`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP10George J. Dance
3 Feb 25 i i i +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP8HarryLime
3 Feb 25 i i i i+- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1HarryLime
4 Feb 25 i i i i`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP6George J. Dance
4 Feb 25 i i i i +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
4 Feb 25 i i i i `* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP4HarryLime
4 Feb 25 i i i i  `* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP3W.Dockery
4 Feb 25 i i i i   `* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP2HarryLime
10 Feb 25 i i i i    `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
3 Feb 25 i i i `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
24 May 25 i i `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
8 Feb 25 i `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
17 Jan 25 +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP23W.Dockery
1 Feb 25 i`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP22George J. Dance
2 Feb 25 i +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP20W.Dockery
2 Feb 25 i i+* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP2HarryLime
13 Feb 25 i ii`- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
2 Feb 25 i i+* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP14George J. Dance
2 Feb 25 i ii+* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP3HarryLime
3 Feb 25 i iii`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP2George J. Dance
3 Feb 25 i iii `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
2 Feb 25 i ii+* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP7W.Dockery
2 Feb 25 i iii`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP6HarryLime
2 Feb 25 i iii +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP2W.Dockery
2 Feb 25 i iii i`- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1HarryLime
3 Feb 25 i iii +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP2George J. Dance
6 Feb 25 i iii i`- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
9 Feb 25 i iii `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
3 Feb 25 i ii+- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
4 Feb 25 i ii+- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
7 Feb 25 i ii`- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
3 Feb 25 i i`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP3George J. Dance
3 Feb 25 i i +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
8 Feb 25 i i `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
19 Feb 25 i `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
31 Jan 25 +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP2W.Dockery
31 Jan 25 i`- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1Rudy Canoza
1 Feb 25 +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
1 Feb 25 +* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP5W.Dockery
2 Feb 25 i`* Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP4George J. Dance
2 Feb 25 i +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
10 Feb 25 i +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
11 Feb 25 i `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
1 Feb 25 +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
2 Feb 25 +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
4 Feb 25 +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
4 Feb 25 +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
7 Feb 25 +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
8 Feb 25 +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
24 May 25 +- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery
25 May 25 `- Re: The Psycho-epistemolgy of MMP1W.Dockery

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