Re: 5th Circuit Strikes Down Bump Stock Ban

On 6/19/24 7:28 PM, BTR1701 wrote:

In article <v4vh5f$258cf$2@dont-email.me>,
  moviePig <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:
 

On 6/19/2024 3:13 PM, BTR1701 wrote:

In article <v4v8jq$23o16$1@dont-email.me>,
   moviePig <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:
>

On 6/18/2024 10:38 PM, BTR1701 wrote:

In article <v4tfnl$1ons5$2@dont-email.me>,
    moviePig <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:
>

On 6/18/2024 9:47 PM, BTR1701 wrote:

In article <v4t1nu$1ig6v$2@dont-email.me>,
     moviePig <nobody@nowhere.com> wrote:
>

On 6/18/2024 5:03 PM, BTR1701 wrote:

In article <v4s1kl$1c3jr$5@dont-email.me>, FPP <fredp1571@gmail.com>
wrote:
>

On 6/15/24 8:30 PM, BTR1701 wrote:

In article
<17d9412e82a8a311$8843$3053472$46d50c60@news.newsdemon.com>,
       trotsky <gmsingh@email.com> wrote:
>

On 6/15/24 11:46 AM, moviePig wrote:

On 6/15/2024 4:20 AM, trotsky wrote:

On 6/14/24 5:47 PM, BTR1701 wrote:

>

The Federal Firearms Act of 1934

>

   From wiki:
>
The current National Firearms Act (NFA) defines a number of
categories of regulated firearms. These weapons are collectively
known as NFA firearms and include the following:
>
Machine guns:
"any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be
readily restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot,
without manual reloading, by a single function of the trigger.
The term shall also include the frame or receiver of any such
weapon, any part designed and intended solely and exclusively,
or combination of parts designed and intended, for use in
converting a weapon into a machinegun, and any combination of
parts from which a machinegun can be assembled if such parts are
in the possession or under the control of a person."[10]

>
So, bump-stocks are patently a "workaround" for a law whose
intent is patently obvious. Not exactly a triumph of sanity.

>
"A work around" is accurate. And the spirit of the law is far more
important, obviously, than the letter of the law

>
Oh, cool! I see Hutt the Fuck-Up Fairy has visited us again!
>
No, Hutt, you're unsurprisingly about as absolutely wrong as you
can be yet again.
>
The letter of the law is obviously paramount in the context of
jurisprudential determination as evidenced by the 1000-page statutes
we have coming out of Congress, millions of pages of administrative
regulations, and the multi-page click-thrus of tiny and near-
hieroglyphic legalese that you have to agree to just to use a
piece of software.
>
If all we needed to concern ourselves with was a law's "spirit",
then none of that would be necessary.
>
I'd elaborate further but I don't have the time or the crayons to
explain it to you. Jeezus, Hutt, if I wanted to kill myself, I'd
climb your ego and jump to your IQ.
>

And how does using a bump stock differ from a fully automatic machine
gun?

>
With a bump stock, for every round fired, a separate trigger pull
occurs.
>
With a machine gun, one one trigger pull is required to fire multiple
rounds.
>
Also, the rate of fire of a bump stock-equipped rifle is significantly
slower than a rifle firing on full-auto.

>
So, this 15-sec. video is a lie?
>
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=brrecvXhRVc

>
I don't know what you're talking about. You can clearly see the bump
device using the recoil (and Newton's Third Law) to reset the trigger
after every round.

>
What I'm seeing is a NOT "significantly slower" rate of fire.

>
The bump device I used produce a fast rate of fire but not as fast as
full-auto rifle. Perhaps this is a different model that works more
efficiently.
>
Regardless, the law passed by Congress did not differentiate "machine
gun" from other guns by how fast it shoots, so the rate of fire is
actually irrelevant to the issue.

>
Yes, we've already established that a determined judiciary can do an
end-run around even the clearest legislative intent.

>
They didn't end-run anything. They only reiterated-- since our
government seems to have lost its way and needs a reminder-- that
Congress is the only body granted the authority by the Constitution to
legislate in this country, not administrative agencies like BATF, and if
Congress wants to change the definition of "machine gun" to incorporate
bump stocks into it, it can do so at any time. However, BATF has no
authority to do it for them.

>
Machine gun:
>
     "...any weapon which shoots, is designed to shoot, or can be readily
restored to shoot, automatically more than one shot, without manual
reloading, by a single function of the trigger."
>
Now, tell me again how either gun in my video doesn't qualify...

 Because with the bump stock, it's only firing one shot per pull of the
trigger. The trigger is just being pulled repeatedly really fast as a
result of rebounding recoil caused by the bump stock. The bumper rocks
the rifle back and forth against the shooter's trigger finger, causing a
separate trigger pull each time. The statute you quoted above clearly
says "by a SINGLE function of the trigger". If you shoot 100 rounds with
a bump stock, you've got 100 functions of the trigger, not a single
function of the trigger.
 Now you tell me, if bump stocks meet the definition of "machine gun" as
written in the statute, why did the BATF feel the need to rewrite the
statute to include them? BATF is on record when bump stocks first became
popular with a determination that a bump stock-equipped rifle does NOT
meet the definition of "machine gun" under the Act. It was only after
the Las Vegas shooting that the BATF-- under political pressure--
decided to promulgate rules that added totally new criteria to the
definition of "machine gun" not found in the actual statute. This is
what got them a spanking by SCOTUS.
 https://babylonbee.com/new/all-bump-stocks-lost-in-boating-accidents-back
-in-2017-miraculously-wash-up-on-shore
 

Yes, it fits. The law doesn't specify a trigger pull by the finger.
It says "a single function of the trigger".
Machine gun requires one pull, and steady pressure on the trigger.
A bump stock requires one pull, and steady pressure on the trigger.
How are they substantively different, counselor?
--
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