Re: Operating temperature derating

On Mon, 03 Jun 2024 15:05:58 -0700, john larkin wrote:

On Mon, 3 Jun 2024 21:41:59 -0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
<cd999666@notformail.com> wrote:
 

On Mon, 03 Jun 2024 09:03:10 -0700, john larkin wrote:
>

On Mon, 3 Jun 2024 07:52:58 -0700, Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid>
wrote:
 

Presumably, one should feel comfortable using a device at the
published operating temperature extremes "forever".
>
But, what sort of derating likely went into that specification in the
first place?  Sad another way, how much *beyond* those limits might
want suspect you could operate the device?

 
I don't think that there are any standards that manufacturers use to
make datasheet abs max specs.
 
I like to test parts to destruction and estimate what they can
actually do. For example, max voltage ratings can sometimes be safely
exceeded, or a surface-mount resistor can dump a lot of power if it's
well heat sunk with copper pours.

>
Some fellow on Youtube a while back managed to get a kilowatt out of a
TO-220 packaged device rated at 100W by blasting it with plumber's
Arctic Spray.
>

Thermal imaging can quantify hot-spot temperatures.
 
Pushing parts past specs is only a good idea if there is a serious
performance upside.
 
RF parts are especially likely to be under-rated. Like a 2 volt rated
schottly detector diode that starts to leak at 7. Or RF amp parts that
actually run at 2x rated max voltage in normal use.

>
Probably because it's common in RF to end up with the part being
subjected to voltages double its normal supply rail figure.

 
When I use RF parts in time domain/pulse applications, I have to make up
my own rules.
 
It's rare to get even basic DC curves on RF parts. The data sheets say,
literally, adjust the bias until it works. Or AC couple in and out and
don't ask questions about "volts". Which opens up the possibility of
novel biasing schemes.

Yeah, RF biasing - well, everything to do with RF in fact is a blast,
isn't it? No wonder the guys at the cutting edge of it have always coined
the BIG BUCKS.

GaN fets are interesting. As are mosfets that avalanche at some
unspecified voltage.
 
A bit of air flow can really change things. I assume that most specs
are based on still air.
 
I've seen a few parts that were unreliable within their abs max specs
and needed to be derated from there.
 
Blow up some parts. It's fun.

>
Best fun you can have with your clothes on as they say.

 
Clothes on and safety goggles.

Indeed. It's amazing how many decibels you can get out of even a 10uF
electrolytic.