Re: Another security vulnerability

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Sujet : Re: Another security vulnerability
De : anton (at) *nospam* mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl)
Groupes : comp.arch
Date : 05. Jun 2024, 09:38:59
Autres entêtes
Organisation : Institut fuer Computersprachen, Technische Universitaet Wien
Message-ID : <2024Jun5.103859@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>
References : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
User-Agent : xrn 10.11
mitchalsup@aol.com (MitchAlsup1) writes:
I am resurrecting this thread to talk about a different cache that
may or may not be vulnerable to Spectré like attacks.
>
Consider an attack strategy that measures whether a disk sector/block
is in (or not in) the OS disk cache. {Very similar to attacks that
figure out if a cache line is in the Data Cache (or not).}
>
Any ideas ??

If you want to claim that there is a vulnerability, it's your job to
demonstrate it.

That being said, filling the OS disk cache requires I/O commands,
typically effected through stores that make it to the I/O device.  In
cases where the I/O is effected through a load, the I/O device is in
an uncacheable part of the address space (otherwise even
non-speculative accesses would not work correctly, and speculative
accesses would have caused havoc long ago), and the load is delayed
until it is no longer speculative.

Ok, you might say, what about just the preparation of the buffer in
ordinary write-back-cached memory?  Yes, that can happen
speculatively, so speculatively executed code might somehow see a
buffer that should later be used for some I/O.  But where is the
security vulnerability in this scenario?  Once the speculation turns
out to be wrong, all the changes in the store buffer will be canceled.
The only trace that remains will (on Spectre-vulnerable hardware) be
in the caches and other microarchitectural features, just as with
existing Spectre attacks.  There is nothing special about disk buffers
here.

And on Spectre-invulnerable hardware (which still does not exist 7
years after the vulnerability has been reported to Intel and AMD:-(,
and the recent announcements of Zen5, Lunar Lake and the new ARM cores
are not promising) no trace of the speculation will be left in
microarchitectural state when it turns out to be wrong.

BTW, it's Spectre without accent, see <https://spectreattack.com/>

- anton
--
'Anyone trying for "industrial quality" ISA should avoid undefined behavior.'
  Mitch Alsup, <c17fcd89-f024-40e7-a594-88a85ac10d20o@googlegroups.com>

Date Sujet#  Auteur
24 Mar 24 * Another security vulnerability58Stephen Fuld
24 Mar 24 +* Re: Another security vulnerability4MitchAlsup1
25 Mar 24 i+* Re: Another security vulnerability2Stefan Monnier
26 Mar 24 ii`- Re: Another security vulnerability1Michael S
26 Mar 24 i`- Re: Another security vulnerability1Michael S
24 Mar 24 +* Re: Another security vulnerability10Lawrence D'Oliveiro
25 Mar 24 i+- Re: Another security vulnerability1Stefan Monnier
25 Mar 24 i`* Re: Another security vulnerability8Stephen Fuld
25 Mar 24 i `* Re: Another security vulnerability7Lawrence D'Oliveiro
26 Mar 24 i  +* Re: Another security vulnerability5MitchAlsup1
26 Mar 24 i  i`* Re: Another security vulnerability4Lawrence D'Oliveiro
27 Mar 24 i  i `* Re: Another security vulnerability3Stephen Fuld
28 Mar 24 i  i  `* Re: Another security vulnerability2Lawrence D'Oliveiro
28 Mar 24 i  i   `- Re: Another security vulnerability1MitchAlsup1
26 Mar 24 i  `- Re: Another security vulnerability1Michael S
25 Mar 24 +* Re: Another security vulnerability18Thomas Koenig
25 Mar 24 i+* Re: Another security vulnerability16Anton Ertl
26 Mar 24 ii+* Re: Another security vulnerability13Lawrence D'Oliveiro
26 Mar 24 iii`* Re: Another security vulnerability12Anton Ertl
5 Jun 24 iii `* Re: Another security vulnerability11MitchAlsup1
5 Jun 24 iii  +* Re: Another security vulnerability9Anton Ertl
11 Jun 24 iii  i`* Re: Another security vulnerability8MitchAlsup1
11 Jun 24 iii  i +* Re: Another security vulnerability6Stephen Fuld
11 Jun 24 iii  i i`* Re: Another security vulnerability5MitchAlsup1
11 Jun 24 iii  i i `* Re: Another security vulnerability4Stephen Fuld
11 Jun 24 iii  i i  `* Re: Another security vulnerability3Terje Mathisen
11 Jun 24 iii  i i   `* SSDs (was: Another security vulnerability)2Stefan Monnier
11 Jun 24 iii  i i    `- Re: SSDs1Chris M. Thomasson
11 Jun 24 iii  i `- Re: Another security vulnerability1MitchAlsup1
11 Jun 24 iii  `- Re: Another security vulnerability1MitchAlsup1
26 Mar 24 ii`* Re: Another security vulnerability2Anton Ertl
26 Mar 24 ii `- Re: Another security vulnerability1Anton Ertl
25 Mar 24 i`- Re: Another security vulnerability1Michael S
25 Mar 24 +* Re: Another security vulnerability22Anton Ertl
26 Mar 24 i`* Re: Another security vulnerability21Michael S
27 Mar 24 i `* Re: Another security vulnerability20Thomas Koenig
27 Mar 24 i  +* Re: Another security vulnerability2Thomas Koenig
27 Mar 24 i  i`- Re: Another security vulnerability1Thomas Koenig
27 Mar 24 i  +- Re: Another security vulnerability1Anton Ertl
27 Mar 24 i  `* Re: Another security vulnerability16Anton Ertl
27 Mar 24 i   `* Re: Another security vulnerability15MitchAlsup1
28 Mar 24 i    +* Re: Another security vulnerability4MitchAlsup1
29 Mar 24 i    i`* Re: Another security vulnerability3Paul A. Clayton
29 Mar 24 i    i `* Re: Another security vulnerability2Paul A. Clayton
30 Mar 24 i    i  `- Re: Another security vulnerability1MitchAlsup1
3 Apr 24 i    `* Re: Another security vulnerability10Stefan Monnier
3 Apr 24 i     `* Re: Another security vulnerability9Thomas Koenig
3 Apr 24 i      +* Re: Another security vulnerability6MitchAlsup1
4 Apr 24 i      i`* Re: Another security vulnerability5Thomas Koenig
4 Apr 24 i      i `* Re: Another security vulnerability4MitchAlsup1
4 Apr 24 i      i  +- Re: Another security vulnerability1MitchAlsup1
7 Apr 24 i      i  `* Re: Another security vulnerability2Paul A. Clayton
8 Apr 24 i      i   `- Re: Another security vulnerability1MitchAlsup1
5 Apr 24 i      `* Re: Another security vulnerability2Stefan Monnier
5 Apr 24 i       `- Re: Another security vulnerability1MitchAlsup1
25 Mar 24 `* Re: Another security vulnerability3John Savard
25 Mar 24  `* Re: Another security vulnerability2Michael S
26 Mar 24   `- Re: Another security vulnerability1Lawrence D'Oliveiro

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