Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)

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Sujet : Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)
De : david.brown (at) *nospam* hesbynett.no (David Brown)
Groupes : comp.arch
Date : 03. Oct 2024, 08:21:13
Autres entêtes
Organisation : A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID : <vdlgl9$3kq50$2@dont-email.me>
References : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16
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On 03/10/2024 02:31, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
On Tue, 1 Oct 2024 23:38:10 -0000 (UTC), Brett wrote:
 
My wish list for the 68k was a barrel roller for fast shifts, would have
made a HUGE difference for the first Macintosh.
 The 68020 certainly had that. It also added bit-field instructions, on top
of the single-bit instructions of the original 68000.
 And in typical big-endian fashion, they added yet another inconsistency to
the way the bits were numbered ...
Since you mentioned POWER and PowerPC elsewhere, the bit numbering challenges of the m68k world are nothing compared to the PowerPC world. Originally, the PowerPC was 32-bit and numbered bits from 0 as the MSB down to 31 as the LSB.  So your 32-bit address bus had lines from A0 down to A31.  Then it got extended to 64-bit (some devices had only partial 64-bit extensions), and the chips got a wider address bus (you never need all 64-bit lines physically) - the pins for the higher address lines were numbered A-1, A-2, and so on.  For the internal registers, some are 64-bit numbered bit 0 (MSB) down to bit 63.  Some were original 32-bit and got extended to 64-bit, and so are numbered bit -32 down to bit 31 for consistency.  Others are 32-bit but numbered from bit 32 down to bit 63.
I am not really complaining - one of our customers hired us precisely because they wanted to use a particular PowerPC microcontroller but after one look at the ten thousand page reference manual full of this kind of thing, they paid us to write a library and drivers for the peripherals they wanted so that they never had to think about that mess.

Date Sujet#  Auteur
1 Oct 24 * Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)387MitchAlsup1
1 Oct 24 `* Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)386Thomas Koenig
1 Oct 24  +* Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)379MitchAlsup1
2 Oct 24  i+* Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)377Brett
3 Oct 24  ii`* Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)376Lawrence D'Oliveiro
3 Oct 24  ii +- Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)1Brett
3 Oct 24  ii +- Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)1Anton Ertl
3 Oct 24  ii `* Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)373David Brown
3 Oct 24  ii  `* Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)372Anton Ertl
3 Oct 24  ii   +- Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)1David Brown
3 Oct 24  ii   +* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)369Lawrence D'Oliveiro
4 Oct 24  ii   i+- Re: Byte ordering1Lynn Wheeler
4 Oct 24  ii   i+* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)365David Brown
4 Oct 24  ii   ii`* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)364Anton Ertl
4 Oct 24  ii   ii +* Re: Byte ordering5BGB
5 Oct 24  ii   ii i`* Re: Byte ordering4MitchAlsup1
5 Oct 24  ii   ii i +* Re: Byte ordering2BGB
5 Oct 24  ii   ii i i`- Re: Byte ordering1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
5 Oct 24  ii   ii i `- Re: Byte ordering1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
5 Oct 24  ii   ii +* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)13Lawrence D'Oliveiro
5 Oct 24  ii   ii i`* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)12Brett
5 Oct 24  ii   ii i `* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)11Anton Ertl
5 Oct 24  ii   ii i  `* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)10Michael S
6 Oct 24  ii   ii i   +- Re: Byte ordering1Terje Mathisen
6 Oct 24  ii   ii i   `* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)8Brett
7 Oct 24  ii   ii i    `* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)7Lawrence D'Oliveiro
7 Oct 24  ii   ii i     `* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)6Brett
7 Oct 24  ii   ii i      `* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)5Michael S
7 Oct 24  ii   ii i       +* Re: Byte ordering2Stefan Monnier
7 Oct 24  ii   ii i       i`- Re: Byte ordering1Michael S
7 Oct 24  ii   ii i       `* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)2Lawrence D'Oliveiro
8 Oct 24  ii   ii i        `- Re: Byte ordering1Terje Mathisen
6 Oct 24  ii   ii `* Re: Byte ordering345David Brown
6 Oct 24  ii   ii  `* Re: Byte ordering344Anton Ertl
6 Oct 24  ii   ii   +* Re: Byte ordering189John Dallman
7 Oct 24  ii   ii   i+* Re: Byte ordering20Lawrence D'Oliveiro
8 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii`* Re: Byte ordering19John Dallman
9 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii +- VMS/NT memory management (was: Byte ordering)1Stefan Monnier
15 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii +* Re: Byte ordering2Lawrence D'Oliveiro
15 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii i`- Re: Byte ordering1MitchAlsup1
15 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii `* Re: Byte ordering15Lawrence D'Oliveiro
15 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  +* Re: Byte ordering3Michael S
15 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  i+- Re: Byte ordering1John Dallman
18 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  i`- Re: Byte ordering1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
15 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  +* Re: Byte ordering9John Dallman
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  i+* Re: Byte ordering7George Neuner
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  ii`* Re: Byte ordering6Terje Mathisen
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  ii `* Re: Byte ordering5David Brown
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  ii  +* Re: Byte ordering2George Neuner
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  ii  i`- Re: Byte ordering1David Brown
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  ii  `* Re: clouds, not Byte ordering2John Levine
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  ii   `- Re: clouds, not Byte ordering1David Brown
18 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  i`- Re: Byte ordering1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii  `* Re: Byte ordering2Paul A. Clayton
18 Oct 24  ii   ii   ii   `- Re: Microkernels & Capabilities (was Re: Byte ordering)1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
7 Oct 24  ii   ii   i`* 80286 protected mode168Anton Ertl
7 Oct 24  ii   ii   i +* Re: 80286 protected mode5Lars Poulsen
7 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i`* Re: 80286 protected mode4Terje Mathisen
7 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i +- Re: 80286 protected mode1Michael S
7 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i `* Re: 80286 protected mode2Lawrence D'Oliveiro
8 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  `- Re: 80286 protected mode1Terje Mathisen
7 Oct 24  ii   ii   i +* Re: 80286 protected mode3Brett
7 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i`* Re: 80286 protected mode2Michael S
7 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i `- Re: 80286 protected mode1Brett
7 Oct 24  ii   ii   i +- Re: 80286 protected mode1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
8 Oct 24  ii   ii   i +* Re: 80286 protected mode152MitchAlsup1
8 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i+* Re: 80286 protected mode4Lawrence D'Oliveiro
8 Oct 24  ii   ii   i ii`* Re: 80286 protected mode3MitchAlsup1
9 Oct 24  ii   ii   i ii +- Re: 80286 protected mode1David Brown
15 Oct 24  ii   ii   i ii `- Re: 80286 protected mode1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
8 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i`* Re: 80286 protected mode147Anton Ertl
8 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i +- Re: 80286 protected mode1Robert Finch
9 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i `* Re: 80286 protected mode145David Brown
9 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  +* Re: 80286 protected mode79MitchAlsup1
9 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i`* Re: 80286 protected mode78David Brown
9 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i `* Re: 80286 protected mode77Stephen Fuld
10 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i  +* Re: 80286 protected mode2MitchAlsup1
10 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i  i`- Re: 80286 protected mode1David Brown
10 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i  +- Re: 80286 protected mode1David Brown
11 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i  `* Re: 80286 protected mode73Tim Rentsch
15 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i   `* Re: 80286 protected mode72Stefan Monnier
15 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    +* Re: 80286 protected mode30MitchAlsup1
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    i+* Re: 80286 protected mode25MitchAlsup1
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    ii+* Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode13John Levine
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iii+* Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode7MitchAlsup1
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iiii`* Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode6John Levine
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iiii `* Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode5Thomas Koenig
20 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iiii  `* Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode4Lawrence D'Oliveiro
20 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iiii   `* Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode3George Neuner
22 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iiii    `* Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode2Tim Rentsch
22 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iiii     `- Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode1George Neuner
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iii+- Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode1David Brown
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iii`* Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode4Paul A. Clayton
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iii +- Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode1David Brown
20 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iii `* Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode2Lawrence D'Oliveiro
20 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iii  `- Re: C and turtles, 80286 protected mode1Paul A. Clayton
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    ii+* Re: 80286 protected mode7Thomas Koenig
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iii+* Re: 80286 protected mode2MitchAlsup1
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iiii`- Re: 80286 protected mode1Tim Rentsch
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iii`* Re: 80286 protected mode4Tim Rentsch
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    iii `* Re: fine points of dynamic memory allocation, not 80286 protected mode3John Levine
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    ii+* Re: 80286 protected mode3George Neuner
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    ii`- Re: 80286 protected mode1Tim Rentsch
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    i+* Re: 80286 protected mode3David Brown
17 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    i`- Re: 80286 protected mode1Tim Rentsch
16 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  i    `* Re: 80286 protected mode41David Brown
9 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  +* Re: 80286 protected mode51Thomas Koenig
13 Oct 24  ii   ii   i i  `* Re: 80286 protected mode14Anton Ertl
8 Oct 24  ii   ii   i `* Re: 80286 protected mode6John Levine
3 Jan 25  ii   ii   `* Re: Byte ordering154Waldek Hebisch
6 Oct 24  ii   i`* Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)2Michael S
3 Oct 24  ii   `- Re: Byte ordering (was: Whether something is RISC or not)1John Dallman
2 Oct 24  i`- Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)1Thomas Koenig
2 Oct 24  +* Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)5David Schultz
3 Oct 24  `- Re: Whether something is RISC or not (Re: PDP-8 theology, not Concertina II Progress)1Lawrence D'Oliveiro

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