Re: What is an N-bit machine?

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Sujet : Re: What is an N-bit machine?
De : sfuld (at) *nospam* alumni.cmu.edu.invalid (Stephen Fuld)
Groupes : comp.arch
Date : 03. Dec 2024, 09:01:34
Autres entêtes
Organisation : A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID : <vimdsu$3lh9o$1@dont-email.me>
References : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
User-Agent : Mozilla Thunderbird
On 12/2/2024 4:56 PM, Brian G. Lucas wrote:
On 12/2/24 3:48 AM, Terje Mathisen wrote:
MitchAlsup1 wrote:
On Sat, 30 Nov 2024 19:40:17 +0000, John Levine wrote:
>
I get the impression that we will have 32 bit architectures for a very
long time, since they are smaller and cheaper to implement than 64 bit
and for a lot of embedded applications they are more than adequate.
Examples are ARM Cortex-R4 and -R5, high performance 32 bit realtime
chips.
>
Still one hardly needs more than a Z80 to run a toaster, microwave,
stove,
oven, faucet, door lock, refrigerator, ... {{Or basically everything
nobody
ever thought would have/need a computer inside of them}}
>
They are still going to end up with a 32-bit CPU in future products!
>
Both because that's needed to support a full development environment/ arbitrary languages and because the cost is becoming mostly trivial:
>
When every single flash/thumb drive has contained a full 32-bit CPU for more than 5 years now, the cost has to be in the cents range.
>
Terje
>
Back in the early 1990s when my group first developed what would become the Motorola MCore, our target was radio (and cell phone) processors.  The intention was to replace the zoo of 16-bit hard to program processors with a 32-bit processor that was easy to program via compilers.  The additional address space was going to be needed for protocol stacks (such as IP/TCP) and support of USB stuff.  Even with the silicon nodes at the time, the resulting processor was not much bigger than bonding pads.
 I agree with Terje, no need to have anything less than 32-bit in embedded.
First, I want to apologize that in my previous post talking about everything going to 64 bits, I forgot about embedded markets.  Note that I used the plural form.  I haven't kept up with embedded markets since the 1990s, so things have probably changed.  But there are embedded markets with other requirements.  For example, for embedded applications such as remote controls (for e.g. TVs and set top boxes), battery life is very important, and pretty minimal functionality and performance are required, so they, at least used to use 4 bit processors.  Another example is the greeting cards that play music when opened.  There any cost more than a few pennies is too expensive.  So there are places where less than 32 bits is appropriate.
--
  - Stephen Fuld
(e-mail address disguised to prevent spam)

Date Sujet#  Auteur
28 Nov 24 * What is an N-bit machine?91John Dallman
28 Nov 24 +* Re: What is an N-bit machine?67Michael S
30 Nov 24 i`* Re: What is an N-bit machine?66John Levine
30 Nov 24 i +* Re: What is an N-bit machine?11Stephen Fuld
30 Nov 24 i i`* Re: What is an N-bit machine?10John Levine
30 Nov 24 i i +* Re: What is an N-bit machine?2Michael S
1 Dec 24 i i i`- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Paul A. Clayton
1 Dec 24 i i `* Re: What is an N-bit machine?7MitchAlsup1
1 Dec 24 i i  +* Re: What is an N-bit machine?2Thomas Koenig
1 Dec 24 i i  i`- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Anton Ertl
2 Dec 24 i i  `* Re: What is an N-bit machine?4Terje Mathisen
3 Dec 24 i i   +* Re: What is an N-bit machine?2Brian G. Lucas
3 Dec 24 i i   i`- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Stephen Fuld
15 Dec 24 i i   `- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Waldek Hebisch
30 Nov 24 i `* Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)54Anton Ertl
30 Nov 24 i  +* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)22Anton Ertl
30 Nov 24 i  i`* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)21Thomas Koenig
30 Nov 24 i  i `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)20Anton Ertl
30 Nov 24 i  i  `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)19Michael S
30 Nov 24 i  i   `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)18Anton Ertl
30 Nov 24 i  i    +* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)12Michael S
1 Dec 24 i  i    i`* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)11Anton Ertl
1 Dec 24 i  i    i `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)10Thomas Koenig
1 Dec 24 i  i    i  +* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses4David Schultz
1 Dec 24 i  i    i  i`* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses3Thomas Koenig
4 Dec 24 i  i    i  i `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses2MitchAlsup1
4 Dec 24 i  i    i  i  `- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses1John Levine
1 Dec 24 i  i    i  `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)5Tim Rentsch
1 Dec 24 i  i    i   +* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)3Thomas Koenig
1 Dec 24 i  i    i   i+- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)1Michael S
1 Dec 24 i  i    i   i`- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)1Brett
2 Dec 24 i  i    i   `- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses1Terje Mathisen
30 Nov 24 i  i    +* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)3John Levine
1 Dec 24 i  i    i`* What is an N-bit machine?2Anton Ertl
16 Dec23:39 i  i    i `- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Waldek Hebisch
1 Dec 24 i  i    `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)2Thomas Koenig
1 Dec 24 i  i     `- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)1Anton Ertl
1 Dec 24 i  +- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses (was: What is an N-bit machine?)1Anton Ertl
2 Dec 24 i  +* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses28Chris M. Thomasson
2 Dec 24 i  i`* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses27MitchAlsup1
2 Dec 24 i  i `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses26Chris M. Thomasson
3 Dec 24 i  i  `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses25Chris M. Thomasson
3 Dec 24 i  i   `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses24Stefan Monnier
3 Dec 24 i  i    +* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses21John Levine
3 Dec 24 i  i    i+* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses18Stefan Monnier
4 Dec 24 i  i    ii`* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses17John Levine
4 Dec 24 i  i    ii `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses16Stefan Monnier
4 Dec 24 i  i    ii  +* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses13MitchAlsup1
4 Dec 24 i  i    ii  i+- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses1Thomas Koenig
4 Dec 24 i  i    ii  i+* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses3Stefan Monnier
4 Dec 24 i  i    ii  ii+- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses1MitchAlsup1
5 Dec 24 i  i    ii  ii`- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses1Keith Thompson
5 Dec 24 i  i    ii  i+- Re: bytes, Keeping other stuff with addresses1John Levine
22 Dec00:22 i  i    ii  i`* unaligned load/store (was: Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses)7Jonathan Thornburg
22 Dec02:27 i  i    ii  i +* Re: unaligned load/store5MitchAlsup1
22 Dec11:01 i  i    ii  i i+* Re: unaligned load/store3Thomas Koenig
22 Dec12:06 i  i    ii  i ii+- Re: unaligned load/store1Anton Ertl
22 Dec12:42 i  i    ii  i ii`- Re: unaligned load/store1John Dallman
22 Dec22:04 i  i    ii  i i`- Re: unaligned load/store1Thomas Koenig
22 Dec11:33 i  i    ii  i `- Re: unaligned load/store (was: Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses)1Anton Ertl
4 Dec 24 i  i    ii  `* Re: bits and bytes, Keeping other stuff with addresses2John Levine
4 Dec 24 i  i    ii   `- Re: bits and bytes, Keeping other stuff with addresses1Stefan Monnier
3 Dec 24 i  i    i`* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses2MitchAlsup1
4 Dec 24 i  i    i `- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses1Chris M. Thomasson
4 Dec 24 i  i    `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses2Chris M. Thomasson
4 Dec 24 i  i     `- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses1Stefan Monnier
4 Dec 24 i  `* Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses2Keith Thompson
4 Dec 24 i   `- Re: Keeping other stuff with addresses1MitchAlsup1
28 Nov 24 +* Re: What is an N-bit machine?18Thomas Koenig
28 Nov 24 i+* Re: What is an N-bit machine?2MitchAlsup1
28 Nov 24 ii`- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Brett
28 Nov 24 i`* Re: What is an N-bit machine?15Lawrence D'Oliveiro
29 Nov 24 i `* Re: What is an N-bit machine?14John Dallman
29 Nov 24 i  +* Re: What is an N-bit machine?9Lynn Wheeler
29 Nov 24 i  i+- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1John Dallman
29 Nov 24 i  i`* IBM and Amdahl history (Re: What is an N-bit machine?)7Anton Ertl
29 Nov 24 i  i +- Re: IBM and Amdahl history (Re: What is an N-bit machine?)1Lynn Wheeler
29 Nov 24 i  i +- Re: IBM and Amdahl history (Re: What is an N-bit machine?)1Lynn Wheeler
29 Nov 24 i  i `* Re: IBM and Amdahl history (Re: What is an N-bit machine?)4Lawrence D'Oliveiro
30 Nov 24 i  i  `* Re: IBM and Amdahl history (Re: What is an N-bit machine?)3Anton Ertl
1 Dec 24 i  i   +- Re: IBM and Amdahl history (Re: What is an N-bit machine?)1John Dallman
1 Dec 24 i  i   `- Re: IBM and Amdahl history (Re: What is an N-bit machine?)1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
29 Nov 24 i  `* Re: What is an N-bit machine?4Lawrence D'Oliveiro
30 Nov 24 i   +- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Brett
30 Nov 24 i   +- Re: market power, What is an N-bit machine?1John Levine
30 Nov 24 i   `- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Lynn Wheeler
28 Nov 24 +- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1MitchAlsup1
28 Nov 24 +- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Lynn Wheeler
29 Nov 24 `* Re: What is an N-bit machine?3Anton Ertl
29 Nov 24  +- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Thomas Koenig
22 Dec22:37  `- Re: What is an N-bit machine?1Lawrence D'Oliveiro

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