Re: Baby X is bor nagain

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Sujet : Re: Baby X is bor nagain
De : david.brown (at) *nospam* hesbynett.no (David Brown)
Groupes : comp.lang.c
Date : 25. Jun 2024, 17:08:42
Autres entêtes
Organisation : A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID : <v5emhq$1jndv$1@dont-email.me>
References : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30
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On 25/06/2024 13:18, bart wrote:
On 25/06/2024 09:19, David Brown wrote:
 
At no point in all this does anyone care in the slightest about the speed of your little toys or of the cute little tcc.  tcc might be ideal for the half-dozen people in the world who think C scripts are a good idea, and it had its place in a time when "live Linux" systems were booted from floppies, but that's about it.
 Yet, projects like mine, and like tcc, show what is possible: just how fast should it take to turn lower level code into machine code.
 
That is not the be-all and end-all of compilers.  Fortunately, real compiler developers think differently from you.
Tools like tcc - and possibly your compiler - are better than nothing. And if you really do have a situation where small size is a concrete requirement (such as Live Linux floppies last century), they can be very useful.  But when you have the option of using something much better, you use something much better.  Disk space costs nothing.  RAM space costs peanuts.  Processor time is dirt cheap.  A major cost is /developer/ time, so you use tools that save the /developer/ time, not tools that save the developer's computer time.  And for a lot of C code - at least, a lot of code that should be written in C, the run time of the final results are a cost.

Since as I said I don't see much difference in such a task compared with doing the same with assembly, or translating textual data into binary.
 So, if someone is using a tool (and perhaps language) that takes 1, 2 or 3 magnitudes longer for the same scale of task, then the trade-offs had better be worthwhile.
An order of magnitude longer than negligible is still not worth bothering about.  Compiler time - for C - does not matter.

 And it shouldn't be because the developers of the tool are lousy at writing performant code. Or they don't care. Or they expect customers to just use faster and bigger hardware.
Do you think the developers of gcc don't care?  Or they are just bad at writing code?  Do you know how laughable that is?  It is not /quite/ as bad as your usual paranoia that the developers behind C, gcc, Linux, make, and countless other things you don't understand created them just to annoy you personally.

 You think it is all totally pointless? Then fuck you.
 
I didn't say your /compiler/ was pointless.  I said your "benchmarks" were pointless.
And I have said your compiler (and tcc) is a toy in comparison to gcc (and clang, MSVC, and other serious tools) for C development.  That again does not mean it can't have some uses - if you like it and use it, then fine.  Just don't expect other people to share your enthusiasm for such limited tools, and certainly don't expect anyone else to share your obsession for meaningless benchmarks and imaginary "lines per second" figures.

Date Sujet#  Auteur
11 Jun 24 * Baby X is bor nagain322Malcolm McLean
11 Jun 24 +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3bart
11 Jun 24 i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Malcolm McLean
12 Jun 24 i `- Mac users (Was: Baby X is bor nagain)1Kenny McCormack
11 Jun 24 +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain4Ben Bacarisse
11 Jun 24 i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3Malcolm McLean
12 Jun 24 i `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Ben Bacarisse
12 Jun 24 i  `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Malcolm McLean
11 Jun 24 +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain313Bonita Montero
11 Jun 24 i+* Re: Baby X is bor nagain309Malcolm McLean
12 Jun 24 ii`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain308Bonita Montero
12 Jun 24 ii +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain305David Brown
12 Jun 24 ii i+* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Malcolm McLean
12 Jun 24 ii ii`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1David Brown
12 Jun 24 ii i+- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Bonita Montero
12 Jun 24 ii i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain301bart
12 Jun 24 ii i +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain4Bonita Montero
12 Jun 24 ii i i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3bart
12 Jun 24 ii i i `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Bonita Montero
12 Jun 24 ii i i  `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1bart
12 Jun 24 ii i `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain296David Brown
12 Jun 24 ii i  `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain295Michael S
13 Jun 24 ii i   +- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Malcolm McLean
13 Jun 24 ii i   `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain293David Brown
13 Jun 24 ii i    +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain5bart
13 Jun 24 ii i    i+* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3tTh
13 Jun 24 ii i    ii`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2bart
14 Jun 24 ii i    ii `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Bonita Montero
13 Jun 24 ii i    i`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Michael S
13 Jun 24 ii i    `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain287Michael S
14 Jun 24 ii i     +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3David Brown
14 Jun 24 ii i     i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2bart
15 Jun 24 ii i     i `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1David Brown
17 Jun 24 ii i     `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain283James Kuyper
17 Jun 24 ii i      +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain86Kaz Kylheku
17 Jun 24 ii i      i+- Are Javascript and Python similarly slow ? (Was: Baby X is bor nagain)1Michael S
17 Jun 24 ii i      i+* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Michael S
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Tim Rentsch
17 Jun 24 ii i      i+* Re: Baby X is bor nagain80David Brown
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain79Michael S
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain78David Brown
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain7bart
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain6David Brown
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  i +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2bart
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  i i`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1David Brown
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  i `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3DFS
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  i  `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Mark Bourne
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  i   `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1DFS
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3Malcolm McLean
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  i+- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1David Brown
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  i`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Mark Bourne
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii  `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain67Michael S
18 Jun 24 ii i      ii   +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain65Malcolm McLean
19 Jun 24 ii i      ii   i+* Re: Baby X is bor nagain59Keith Thompson
19 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain58Malcolm McLean
19 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain56David Brown
19 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain55Malcolm McLean
19 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain54David Brown
19 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i  `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain53Malcolm McLean
19 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain10bart
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain9David Brown
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   i `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain8bart
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   i  `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain7David Brown
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   i   `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain6bart
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   i    +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Michael S
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   i    i`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1bart
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   i    `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3David Brown
21 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   i     `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2bart
21 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   i      `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1David Brown
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i   `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain42David Brown
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i    `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain41Malcolm McLean
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i     +- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1David Brown
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i     `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain39Ben Bacarisse
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Malcolm McLean
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      i`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Ben Bacarisse
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain9Tim Rentsch
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain8Malcolm McLean
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      i +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2James Kuyper
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      i i`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Keith Thompson
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      i +- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Vir Campestris
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      i +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Keith Thompson
21 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      i i`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1vallor
21 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      i +- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Tim Rentsch
21 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      i `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1David Brown
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i      `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain27Keith Thompson
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i       `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain26Ben Bacarisse
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i        +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Michael S
21 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i        i`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Ben Bacarisse
20 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i        +- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Keith Thompson
21 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i        +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2James Kuyper
21 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i        i`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Keith Thompson
22 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i        `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain20Tim Rentsch
23 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i         `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain19Ben Bacarisse
23 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i          +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain9James Kuyper
23 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i          i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain8Tim Rentsch
24 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i          i +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain4Ben Bacarisse
24 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i          i i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3Tim Rentsch
25 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i          i i `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Ben Bacarisse
25 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i          i i  `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Tim Rentsch
24 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i          i `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3Keith Thompson
24 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i          i  `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain2Tim Rentsch
23 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii i          `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain9Tim Rentsch
19 Jun 24 ii i      ii   ii `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Keith Thompson
19 Jun 24 ii i      ii   i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain5David Brown
19 Jun 24 ii i      ii   `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1David Brown
18 Jun 24 ii i      i+- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1James Kuyper
20 Jun 24 ii i      i`- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Vir Campestris
17 Jun 24 ii i      +* Re: Baby X is bor nagain193bart
17 Jun 24 ii i      `* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3Malcolm McLean
12 Jun 24 ii `* Topicality is not your strong suit (Was: Baby X is bor nagain)2Kenny McCormack
11 Jun 24 i`* Re: Baby X is bor nagain3bart
11 Jun 24 `- Re: Baby X is bor nagain1Kalevi Kolttonen

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