Re: this girl calls c ugly

Liste des GroupesRevenir à cl c  
Sujet : Re: this girl calls c ugly
De : bc (at) *nospam* freeuk.com (Bart)
Groupes : comp.lang.c
Date : 31. May 2026, 18:11:05
Autres entêtes
Organisation : A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID : <10vhq39$1lpo1$1@dont-email.me>
References : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
User-Agent : Mozilla Thunderbird
On 31/05/2026 17:04, Tim Rentsch wrote:
Richard Harnden <richard.nospam@gmail.invalid> writes:
 
just write complex expressions in a way that a human can most
easily understand,
 Unfortunately, (1) different people have different ideas of what
writing is most easily understood, and (2) different readers have
different notions of which writings are easily understood, and
which writings are not so easily understood.  To make things
worse "easily understood" is not a boolean condition, nor is it
necessarily well-ordered -- "most easily understood" isn't always
a well-defined quality, even for a given audience.
 Sadly the idea of writing in a way that is "most easily understood"
has resulted in a race to the bottom, where writers are more and
more encouraged to take the view that (some) readers are pretty
much arbitrarily stupid, with the result that expressions become
littered with scads of unnecessary parentheses that actually
detract from ease of reading.  Good writing is always a balance
between too much and too little.
Actual examples of too many parentheses?
I don't think they are needed for the three main groups (unless you need to override the normal behaviour):
* Arithmetic ops that everyone knows
* Comparison ops which can be considered a single level
   (in C there are two, but they are rarely chained)
* Logical AND/OR ops
Most involved in coding should know the order of these groups and will know that AND takes precedence over OR because that is common.
The leaves the following which are not used in the real world and which are diverse across languages:
   << >> & | ^
There it makes sense to use parentheses to make things clear when any of these appear, but only if there is more than one and they are mixed.
I don't think that is particularly onerous to have to write, or too much clutter to read.
I wouldn't call anyone stupid for using () in such cases; more pragmatic.
There are some odd ones such as "." (not even considered a binary operator in some languages), and assignment, but these also commonly behave the same way across languages.
And then there is ?: :
   a > b ? c : d       # (a>b)?c:d
   a + b ? c : d       # (a+b)?c:d
The grouping of the first is probably what is intended. But in the second, the intent might have been (a+b)?c:d, or a+(b?c:c); we don't know for sure that the author didn't make a mistake or we don't know outselves.
Another candidate for parentheses when there are leading or trailing binary ops involved.

Date Sujet#  Auteur
27 May 26 * this girl calls c ugly371fir
27 May 26 `* Re: this girl calls c ugly370fir
28 May 26  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly369BGB
28 May 26   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly5Lawrence D’Oliveiro
28 May 26   i+* Re: this girl calls c ugly3BGB
29 May 26   ii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Lawrence D’Oliveiro
29 May 26   ii `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1BGB
28 May 26   i`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Bonita Montero
28 May 26   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly19Janis Papanagnou
28 May 26   i+* Re: this girl calls c ugly15BGB
29 May 26   ii+- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Lawrence D’Oliveiro
29 May 26   ii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly13Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26   ii `* Re: this girl calls c ugly12BGB
29 May 26   ii  +* Re: this girl calls c ugly9David Brown
29 May 26   ii  i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly8BGB
30 May 26   ii  i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly7David Brown
30 May 26   ii  i  +* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Janis Papanagnou
30 May 26   ii  i  i`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1David Brown
30 May 26   ii  i  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly4BGB
31 May 26   ii  i   `* Re: this girl calls c ugly3David Brown
31 May 26   ii  i    `* Re: this girl calls c ugly2BGB
31 May 26   ii  i     `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1David Brown
29 May 26   ii  +- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Janis Papanagnou
30 May 26   ii  `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Lawrence D’Oliveiro
28 May 26   i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly3Chris M. Thomasson
29 May 26   i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26   i  `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Chris M. Thomasson
28 May 26   `* Re: this girl calls c ugly344fir
28 May 26    `* Re: this girl calls c ugly343BGB
29 May 26     +* Re: this girl calls c ugly336Lawrence D’Oliveiro
29 May 26     i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly335Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly334Bart
29 May 26     i  +* Re: this girl calls c ugly318Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly317Bart
29 May 26     i  i +* Re: this girl calls c ugly9Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i i+* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Bart
29 May 26     i  i ii`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly6Bart
29 May 26     i  i i +* Re: this girl calls c ugly4Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i i i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly3Bart
29 May 26     i  i i i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i i i  `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Bart
29 May 26     i  i i `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Keith Thompson
29 May 26     i  i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly307tTh
29 May 26     i  i  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly306Bart
29 May 26     i  i   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly304Keith Thompson
29 May 26     i  i   i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly303Bart
29 May 26     i  i   i +- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i   i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly301Keith Thompson
29 May 26     i  i   i  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly300Bart
29 May 26     i  i   i   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly5Keith Thompson
30 May 26     i  i   i   i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly4James Kuyper
30 May 26     i  i   i   i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly3Bart
30 May 26     i  i   i   i  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Keith Thompson
30 May 26     i  i   i   i   `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Bart
30 May 26     i  i   i   `* Re: this girl calls c ugly294Dan Cross
30 May 26     i  i   i    +* Re: this girl calls c ugly290Bart
31 May 26     i  i   i    i+* Re: this girl calls c ugly288Keith Thompson
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii+* Re: this girl calls c ugly5Janis Papanagnou
31 May 26     i  i   i    iii+* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Keith Thompson
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    iiii`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Janis Papanagnou
31 May 26     i  i   i    iii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly2David Brown
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    iii `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Janis Papanagnou
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly282Richard Harnden
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii +* Re: this girl calls c ugly175David Brown
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii i+* Re: this girl calls c ugly172Bart
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii ii+* Re: this girl calls c ugly146David Brown
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly145James Kuyper
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii `* Re: this girl calls c ugly144David Brown
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii  +* Re: this girl calls c ugly4James Kuyper
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii  i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly3David Brown
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii  i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly2James Kuyper
1 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii  i  `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1David Brown
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly139Keith Thompson
1 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly2David Brown
1 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   i`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Keith Thompson
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly135Janis Papanagnou
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   i+- Re: this girl calls c ugly1James Kuyper
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   i+* Constants and undefined behavior88Tim Rentsch
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior87Dan Cross
4 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior86Tim Rentsch
4 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii  `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior85Dan Cross
4 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   +* Re: Constants and undefined behavior35Keith Thompson
5 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   i+* Re: Constants and undefined behavior32Dan Cross
5 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   ii+* Re: Constants and undefined behavior28Keith Thompson
6 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iii+* Re: Constants and undefined behavior23Dan Cross
6 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior22Keith Thompson
8 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior21Dan Cross
8 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  +* Re: Constants and undefined behavior5Keith Thompson
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  i`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior4Dan Cross
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  i `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior3Keith Thompson
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  i  `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior2Dan Cross
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  i   `- Re: Constants and undefined behavior1Keith Thompson
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior15Waldek Hebisch
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   +* Re: Constants and undefined behavior3James Kuyper
10 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   i`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior2Keith Thompson
10 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   i `- Re: Constants and undefined behavior1Dan Cross
11 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   +* Re: Constants and undefined behavior9Janis Papanagnou
11 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   i+* Re: Constants and undefined behavior2Dan Cross
11 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   ii`- Re: Constants and undefined behavior1Janis Papanagnou
11 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   i`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior6Waldek Hebisch
21 Jun22:26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior2Tim Rentsch
6 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iii`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior4Tim Rentsch
5 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   ii`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior3Janis Papanagnou
7 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   i`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior2Tim Rentsch
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior49Tim Rentsch
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly45Keith Thompson
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Chris M. Thomasson
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii ii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly25Dan Cross
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly2James Kuyper
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii +* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Keith Thompson
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii `* Re: this girl calls c ugly104Tim Rentsch
31 May 26     i  i   i    i`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Dan Cross
1 Jun 26     i  i   i    `* Re: this girl calls c ugly3Tim Rentsch
30 May 26     i  i   `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1David Brown
29 May 26     i  +* Re: this girl calls c ugly6Janis Papanagnou
30 May 26     i  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly9Lawrence D’Oliveiro
29 May 26     `* Re: this girl calls c ugly6Bonita Montero

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