Re: Constants and undefined behavior

Liste des GroupesRevenir à cl c  
Sujet : Re: Constants and undefined behavior
De : cross (at) *nospam* spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross)
Groupes : comp.lang.c
Date : 15. Jun 2026, 18:52:09
Autres entêtes
Organisation : PANIX Public Access Internet and UNIX, NYC
Message-ID : <110pe49$5fa$1@reader1.panix.com>
References : 1 2 3 4
User-Agent : trn 4.0-test77 (Sep 1, 2010)
In article <8_EXR.112952$Mm3.81340@fx33.iad>,
Scott Lurndal <slp53@pacbell.net> wrote:
ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de (Stefan Ram) writes:
cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net (Dan Cross) wrote or quoted:
I'm not a huge fan of Carruth.
>
 (Text after "| " below was generated by a chatbot asked to explain
 narrow contracts and the reduction of efficiency by defining UB.)
>
 (Let me guess: You are not a huge fan of chatbots either!
 Ok, that was easy.)
>
 Chandler talked about how narrow contracts allow optimizations.
>
| - Wide Contract: The function guarantees to handle all possible inputs
|   gracefully, usually by returning an error code or throwing an
|   exception. (e.g., "If the pointer is null, return ERR_NULL_PTR").
|
| - Narrow Contract: The function only guarantees correct behavior if
|   the caller meets specific preconditions. If the preconditions are
|   violated, the behavior is undefined.
|
| When is it appropriate to have a narrow contract? Always, when
| performance, memory footprint, or direct hardware control are
| paramount. In operating system kernels, embedded systems, real-time
| applications, and high-performance computing, the overhead of
| validating every pointer, checking every array bound, and verifying
| every integer range is unacceptable.
>
I have a  recollection that a version of IBM's MVS operating
system did, indeed, validate input and output arguments to kernel
functions.
>
Indeed, google says it was called MVS/SP and later MVS/XA (extended addressing).

The Midori folks at Microsoft added bounds checking to all array
accesses in M# (the safe language they wrote Midori in).  They
expected performance to be awful; when they provided it, the
overhead was pretty much undetectable: the cost was in the
noise.

- Dan C.


Date Sujet#  Auteur
27 May 26 * this girl calls c ugly365fir
27 May 26 `* Re: this girl calls c ugly364fir
28 May 26  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly363BGB
28 May 26   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly5Lawrence D’Oliveiro
28 May 26   i+* Re: this girl calls c ugly3BGB
29 May 26   ii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Lawrence D’Oliveiro
29 May 26   ii `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1BGB
28 May 26   i`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Bonita Montero
28 May 26   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly19Janis Papanagnou
28 May 26   i+* Re: this girl calls c ugly15BGB
29 May 26   ii+- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Lawrence D’Oliveiro
29 May 26   ii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly13Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26   ii `* Re: this girl calls c ugly12BGB
29 May 26   ii  +* Re: this girl calls c ugly9David Brown
29 May 26   ii  i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly8BGB
30 May 26   ii  i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly7David Brown
30 May 26   ii  i  +* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Janis Papanagnou
30 May 26   ii  i  i`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1David Brown
30 May 26   ii  i  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly4BGB
31 May 26   ii  i   `* Re: this girl calls c ugly3David Brown
31 May 26   ii  i    `* Re: this girl calls c ugly2BGB
31 May 26   ii  i     `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1David Brown
29 May 26   ii  +- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Janis Papanagnou
30 May 26   ii  `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Lawrence D’Oliveiro
28 May 26   i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly3Chris M. Thomasson
29 May 26   i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26   i  `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Chris M. Thomasson
28 May 26   `* Re: this girl calls c ugly338fir
28 May 26    `* Re: this girl calls c ugly337BGB
29 May 26     +* Re: this girl calls c ugly330Lawrence D’Oliveiro
29 May 26     i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly329Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly328Bart
29 May 26     i  +* Re: this girl calls c ugly312Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly311Bart
29 May 26     i  i +* Re: this girl calls c ugly9Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i i+* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Bart
29 May 26     i  i ii`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly6Bart
29 May 26     i  i i +* Re: this girl calls c ugly4Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i i i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly3Bart
29 May 26     i  i i i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i i i  `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Bart
29 May 26     i  i i `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Keith Thompson
29 May 26     i  i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly301tTh
29 May 26     i  i  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly300Bart
29 May 26     i  i   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly298Keith Thompson
29 May 26     i  i   i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly297Bart
29 May 26     i  i   i +- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Janis Papanagnou
29 May 26     i  i   i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly295Keith Thompson
29 May 26     i  i   i  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly294Bart
29 May 26     i  i   i   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly5Keith Thompson
30 May 26     i  i   i   i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly4James Kuyper
30 May 26     i  i   i   i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly3Bart
30 May 26     i  i   i   i  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Keith Thompson
30 May 26     i  i   i   i   `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Bart
30 May 26     i  i   i   `* Re: this girl calls c ugly288Dan Cross
30 May 26     i  i   i    +* Re: this girl calls c ugly284Bart
31 May 26     i  i   i    i+* Re: this girl calls c ugly282Keith Thompson
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii+* Re: this girl calls c ugly5Janis Papanagnou
31 May 26     i  i   i    iii+* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Keith Thompson
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    iiii`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Janis Papanagnou
31 May 26     i  i   i    iii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly2David Brown
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    iii `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Janis Papanagnou
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly276Richard Harnden
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii +* Re: this girl calls c ugly171David Brown
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii i+* Re: this girl calls c ugly168Bart
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii ii+* Re: this girl calls c ugly142David Brown
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly141James Kuyper
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii `* Re: this girl calls c ugly140David Brown
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii  +* Re: this girl calls c ugly4James Kuyper
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii  i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly3David Brown
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii  i `* Re: this girl calls c ugly2James Kuyper
1 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii  i  `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1David Brown
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii iii  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly135Keith Thompson
1 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly2David Brown
1 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   i`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Keith Thompson
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   +* Re: this girl calls c ugly131Janis Papanagnou
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   i+- Re: this girl calls c ugly1James Kuyper
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   i+* Constants and undefined behavior84Tim Rentsch
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior83Dan Cross
4 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior82Tim Rentsch
4 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii  `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior81Dan Cross
4 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   +* Re: Constants and undefined behavior31Keith Thompson
5 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   i+* Re: Constants and undefined behavior28Dan Cross
5 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   ii+* Re: Constants and undefined behavior24Keith Thompson
6 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iii+* Re: Constants and undefined behavior19Dan Cross
6 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior18Keith Thompson
8 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior17Dan Cross
8 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  +* Re: Constants and undefined behavior5Keith Thompson
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  i`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior4Dan Cross
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  i `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior3Keith Thompson
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  i  `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior2Dan Cross
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  i   `- Re: Constants and undefined behavior1Keith Thompson
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii  `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior11Waldek Hebisch
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   +* Re: Constants and undefined behavior3James Kuyper
10 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   i`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior2Keith Thompson
10 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   i `- Re: Constants and undefined behavior1Dan Cross
11 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii   `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior7Janis Papanagnou
11 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii    +* Re: Constants and undefined behavior2Dan Cross
11 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii    i`- Re: Constants and undefined behavior1Janis Papanagnou
11 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iiii    `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior4Waldek Hebisch
6 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   iii`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior4Tim Rentsch
5 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   ii`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior3Janis Papanagnou
7 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   i`* Re: Constants and undefined behavior2Tim Rentsch
9 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   ii   `* Re: Constants and undefined behavior49Tim Rentsch
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly45Keith Thompson
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii iii   `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Chris M. Thomasson
2 Jun 26     i  i   i    ii ii`* Re: this girl calls c ugly25Dan Cross
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii i`* Re: this girl calls c ugly2James Kuyper
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii +* Re: this girl calls c ugly2Keith Thompson
31 May 26     i  i   i    ii `* Re: this girl calls c ugly102Tim Rentsch
31 May 26     i  i   i    i`- Re: this girl calls c ugly1Dan Cross
1 Jun 26     i  i   i    `* Re: this girl calls c ugly3Tim Rentsch
30 May 26     i  i   `- Re: this girl calls c ugly1David Brown
29 May 26     i  +* Re: this girl calls c ugly6Janis Papanagnou
30 May 26     i  `* Re: this girl calls c ugly9Lawrence D’Oliveiro
29 May 26     `* Re: this girl calls c ugly6Bonita Montero

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