Re: Fedora proposing to remove X11 Gnome

On 2025-04-29, CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:

On 2025-04-29 10:08, Borax Man wrote:

On 2025-04-29, CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote:

On 2025-04-28 22:51, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

On Mon, 28 Apr 2025 11:44:01 -0000 (UTC), Borax Man wrote:
>

Windows is THE desktop operating system.

>
Only for those who insist on remaining loyal, no matter how buggy and
broken their systems become.

>
The increasingly painful experience of updating Windows or MacOS says
all that he needs to know about whether Windows is "the" operating
system or not. We all eventually get annoyed with that, but there are
other irreparable problems in the operating system that cause more
capable individuals to look elsewhere. fTPM stuttering is not likely to
be fixed for AMD laptop users, external monitors are likely to shut off
repeatedly if you play DRM content of any kind, S0 suspend is likely to
be the norm regardless of how inefficient and wasteful it is. Those are
just three good reasons to move away.
>

 
It is still the dominant desktop operating system.  Whether it deserves
to be or not, thats up for debate.

>
As long as manufacturers don't give people the option to buy their
hardware without Windows bundled on, it will retain much of its
dominance. If ever manufacturers are being treated poorly by Microsoft,
it might be beneficial for them to offer a choice upon initial bootup
the way the Endeavour OS installer does. Before you go through with
installation, it gives you a list of desktop environments you can use as
screenshots of how they look. This would work, but I believe Microsoft
makes it impossible for manufacturers to offer that kind of choice. If
I'm not mistaken, they tell manufacturers that if they want to carry
Windows, they cannot offer anything else. This applies for the hardware
found in stores, at the very least.
>

To be honest, it was many years of using a PC before I too understood
that there could be a viable alternative on the PC, and I was more "tech
literate" than average.  This was in the 90s.  I knew of OS2 and some
toy OS's.  I started to get annoyed with Windows, and desire features
and abilities that it was lacking.  When I found that Linux was a thing,
it kind of mostly met what I was looking for (more power!).

I moved away decades ago.  I've gotten others to move away, but the
numbers dont lie.  Most people just take the pain and live with Windows.

>
Windows does offer a good operating system, but the pain becomes worse
when you are aware that you can avoid a good chunk of it. If you are
like my students and don't even know what your operating system is,
you're likely to just put up with it. If you grew up with technology and
saw it progress, you're likely to be knowledgeable and aware that Linux
offers some respite. I'm an example of that. I can tolerate all sorts of
bullshit but even I have my breaking point.
>

One of the barriers, is people cannot really imagine anything better.
People just accepted in the 90s that computers were unstable and
crashed.  It was just a given, but when my friends asked me about Linux,
and I showed that I could burn a CD, listen to music and download a file
and browse *at the same time*, they were impressed.  Computers didn't
need to crash.  You can do reptetive tasks far, far more efficiently
than clicking through a series of GUI elements 24 times over.  These are
moments where people can realise they can do things, things they didn't
think they could do. Emacs was an experience like that too.  For year
just using basic editing, then finding you can select words, sentences,
transpose, etc.  I use emacs at work, (mostly for org mode) and people
think I'm using DOS, but when they see how I manage my todo lists, it
seems like magic.