Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof

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Sujet : Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof
De : polcott333 (at) *nospam* gmail.com (olcott)
Groupes : comp.theory
Date : 04. Jul 2025, 23:08:49
Autres entêtes
Organisation : A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID : <1049jdi$11mmt$1@dont-email.me>
References : 1 2
User-Agent : Mozilla Thunderbird
On 7/4/2025 3:24 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
On 7/4/25 4:16 PM, olcott wrote:
https://claude.ai/share/48aab578-aec3-44a5-8bb3-6851e0f8b02e
>
 Since you LIE with the following statement;
 Termination Analyzer HHH simulates its input until
it detects a non-terminating behavior pattern. When
HHH detects such a pattern it aborts its simulation
and returns 0.
 Since there is no such pattern in the input, since its execution halts,
Directly executed Turing machines are outside of the
domain of every Turing machine partial halt decider,
thus DDD() does not contradict HHH(DDD)==0.

since HHH DOES return 0 as you stipulated, this statement is just a lie of asserting the existance of a condition that doesn't exist.
 

Note, its first conclusion was:
 Both analyzers correctly identify the termination behavior, demonstrating that the halting problem's undecidability doesn't prevent practical termination analysis in specific cases where patterns can be detected.
 
Ah great so you didn't totally ignore what it said.

Note the conditional WHERE PATTERS CAN BE DETECTED. Since there is no correct pattern, HHH can't detect what doesn't exist, and thus if it ACTUALLY did what you claimed was its algorithm, it would run forever and fail to be a decider.
 
It also said that it does detect this pattern itself.
It put that on its second page.
*Execution Trace of DD correctly simulated by HHH*
When HHH(DD) simulates DD:
1. HHH begins simulating DD
2. DD calls HHH(DD) - this creates a recursive simulation
3. HHH detects that simulating DD leads to DD calling HHH(DD) again
4. This creates an infinite recursive pattern: DD→HHH(DD)→DD→HHH(DD)→...

So, all you are doing is proving that you logic is based on lying, and that AI isn't smart enough yet to detect that lie.
Not at all. This is merely you not paying close enough attention.
--
Copyright 2025 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer

Date Sujet#  Auteur
4 Jul 25 * Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof50olcott
4 Jul 25 +* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof9Richard Damon
4 Jul 25 i`* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof8olcott
5 Jul 25 i +* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof4Fred. Zwarts
5 Jul 25 i i`* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof3olcott
6 Jul01:14 i i +- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Richard Damon
6 Jul10:15 i i `- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Fred. Zwarts
5 Jul 25 i `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof3Richard Damon
5 Jul 25 i  `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof2olcott
6 Jul01:20 i   `- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Richard Damon
5 Jul 25 +- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Mikko
5 Jul 25 `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof39Mikko
5 Jul 25  `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof38olcott
6 Jul09:30   `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof37Mikko
6 Jul15:48    `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof36olcott
6 Jul17:41     +- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Richard Damon
7 Jul09:20     `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof34Mikko
7 Jul14:57      `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof33olcott
8 Jul00:10       +- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Richard Damon
8 Jul08:41       `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof31Mikko
8 Jul15:18        `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof30olcott
9 Jul09:29         +* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof28Mikko
9 Jul13:31         i`* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof27olcott
9 Jul15:04         i +* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof14joes
9 Jul15:16         i i+* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof12olcott
10 Jul10:05         i ii+* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof10Mikko
10 Jul15:09         i iii`* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof9olcott
11 Jul09:43         i iii `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof8Mikko
11 Jul16:30         i iii  `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof7olcott
11 Jul16:50         i iii   +* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof5joes
11 Jul21:52         i iii   i`* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof4olcott
11 Jul23:58         i iii   i +- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Richard Damon
12 Jul11:54         i iii   i `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof2joes
12 Jul16:18         i iii   i  `- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1olcott
11 Jul23:55         i iii   `- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Richard Damon
10 Jul12:26         i ii`- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Richard Damon
9 Jul16:09         i i`- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1olcott
10 Jul10:02         i `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof12Mikko
10 Jul15:09         i  `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof11olcott
10 Jul15:55         i   +* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof2olcott
11 Jul02:59         i   i`- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Richard Damon
11 Jul02:58         i   +* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof7Richard Damon
11 Jul04:58         i   i`* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof6André G. Isaak
11 Jul05:29         i   i `* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof5olcott
11 Jul05:42         i   i  +* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof3André G. Isaak
11 Jul06:12         i   i  i`* Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof2olcott
12 Jul18:09         i   i  i `- André G. Isaak still has not noticed his mistake1olcott
11 Jul14:35         i   i  `- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Richard Damon
11 Jul09:47         i   `- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Mikko
9 Jul12:09         `- Re: Claude.ai provides reasoning why I may have defeated the conventional HP proof1Richard Damon

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