Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now

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Sujet : Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now
De : polcott333 (at) *nospam* gmail.com (olcott)
Groupes : comp.theory
Date : 01. Oct 2024, 18:31:41
Autres entêtes
Organisation : A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID : <vdhblt$2qm1j$2@dont-email.me>
References : 1 2 3
User-Agent : Mozilla Thunderbird
On 10/1/2024 8:09 AM, joes wrote:
Am Tue, 01 Oct 2024 07:39:18 -0500 schrieb olcott:
On 10/1/2024 7:19 AM, olcott wrote:
https://www.google.com/search?
>
q=Termination+Analyzer+H+is+Not+Fooled+by+Pathological+Input+D&sca_esv=889093c5cb21af9e&sca_upv=1&source=hp&ei=Muf7ZpOyMZHfwN4PwYL2gAc&iflsig=AL9hbdgAAAAAZvv1Qg04jNg2ze170z3a8BSGu8pA29Fj&ved=0ahUKEwiTk7zkk-2IAxWRL9AFHUGBHXAQ4dUDCBg&uact=5&oq=Termination+Analyzer+H+is+Not+Fooled+by+Pathological+Input+D&gs_lp=Egdnd3Mtd2l6IjxUZXJtaW5hdGlvbiBBbmFseXplciBIIGlzIE5vdCBGb29sZWQgYnkgUGF0aG9sb2dpY2FsIElucHV0IERIAFAAWABwAHgAkAEAmAEAoAEAqgEAuAEDyAEA-
AEC-AEBmAIAoAIAmAMAkgcAoAcA&sclient=gws-wiz
https://chatgpt.com/share/66fbec5c-7b10-8011-9ce6-3c26424cb21c
It sounds like it’s trained on your spam. LLMs don’t know anything anyway.
 I asked: „What happens when HHH tries to simulate itself?”
ChatGPT: [my comments in brackets]
When `HHH` tries to simulate itself, it encounters a potential problem
known as **self-referential recursion**. Here’s a breakdown of what
happens:
 ### 1. **Self-Invocation in HHH**
If `HHH` calls itself (i.e., `HHH(HHH)`), it creates an infinite loop of
calls unless there is some form of termination condition built into `HHH`.
Without such a condition, `HHH` would never return, resulting in non-
termination.
 [So not a decider.]
 ### 2. **Halting Criteria**
In a well-designed termination analyzer, `HHH` would need to have specific
logic to prevent endless recursion:
- **Base Case or Exit Condition**: There should be a mechanism to
recognize when `HHH` is being asked to analyze itself and return
immediately (e.g., a special case or flag).
- **Tracking State**: The analyzer might maintain a history of function
calls to detect cycles. If it recognizes that it is attempting to analyze
itself again, it can decide that this leads to non-termination.
 [Not present.]
 ### 3. **Practical Consequences**
If `HHH` lacks the ability to handle self-referential calls correctly:
- **Stack Overflow**: Continuous self-invocation will eventually exhaust
the stack memory, leading to a stack overflow error.
[Not considered in theory.]
- **Incorrect Results**: If not designed carefully, it may lead to an
incorrect conclusion about halting, misrepresenting itself as either
halting or non-halting.
  ### 4. **Best Practices for Termination Analyzers**
To avoid these pitfalls, a termination analyzer should implement:
- **Guard Clauses**: Checks at the beginning of the function to prevent
unnecessary self-simulation.
- **State Management**: A way to track the functions being analyzed,
allowing `HHH` to recognize if it's being invoked with itself and act
accordingly.
 ### Conclusion
In summary, if `HHH` tries to simulate itself without proper safeguards,
it risks falling into an infinite recursion or causing a stack overflow. A
robust design would include checks to prevent self-invocation, ensuring
the termination analyzer can handle all cases, including its own function,
gracefully.
  There you go.
 
*You can continue this conversation with ChatGPT*
Click on the link and see how it answers this question:
Is H a Halt Decider for D?
--
Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer

Date Sujet#  Auteur
1 Oct 24 * Even Google AI Overview understands me now123olcott
1 Oct 24 +* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now115olcott
1 Oct 24 i+* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now103joes
1 Oct 24 ii`* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now102olcott
1 Oct 24 ii `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now101joes
2 Oct 24 ii  +* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now99olcott
2 Oct 24 ii  i`* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now98Richard Damon
2 Oct 24 ii  i `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now97olcott
3 Oct 24 ii  i  +* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now95Richard Damon
3 Oct 24 ii  i  i`* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!94olcott
3 Oct 24 ii  i  i +* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!26Richard Damon
4 Oct 24 ii  i  i i`* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!25olcott
4 Oct 24 ii  i  i i `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!24Richard Damon
4 Oct 24 ii  i  i i  `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!23olcott
4 Oct 24 ii  i  i i   `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!22Richard Damon
4 Oct 24 ii  i  i i    `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!21olcott
5 Oct 24 ii  i  i i     `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!20Richard Damon
5 Oct 24 ii  i  i i      `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!19olcott
5 Oct 24 ii  i  i i       `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!18Richard Damon
5 Oct 24 ii  i  i i        `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!17olcott
5 Oct 24 ii  i  i i         `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!16Richard Damon
5 Oct 24 ii  i  i i          `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!15olcott
5 Oct 24 ii  i  i i           `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!14Richard Damon
5 Oct 24 ii  i  i i            `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!13olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i             `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!12Richard Damon
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i              `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!11olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i               `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!10Richard Damon
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i                `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!9olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i                 `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!8Richard Damon
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i                  `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!7olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i                   `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!6Richard Damon
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i                    +- Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!1immibis
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i                    `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!4olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i                     `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!3Richard Damon
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i                      `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!2olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i i                       `- Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!1Richard Damon
3 Oct 24 ii  i  i `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!67Mikko
3 Oct 24 ii  i  i  `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!66olcott
4 Oct 24 ii  i  i   +- Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!1Richard Damon
4 Oct 24 ii  i  i   +* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!62Mikko
4 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i`* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!61olcott
5 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!60Mikko
5 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i  `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!59olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i   `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!58Mikko
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i    `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!57olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     +* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!53Richard Damon
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i`* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!52olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!51Richard Damon
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i  `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!50olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i   `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!49Richard Damon
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i    `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!48olcott
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i     `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!47Richard Damon
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i      +* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!2olcott
7 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i      i`- Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!1Richard Damon
6 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i      `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- My Stupid Mistake44olcott
7 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i       `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- My Stupid Mistake43Richard Damon
7 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i        `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- My Stupid Mistake42olcott
7 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i         `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- My Stupid Mistake41Richard Damon
7 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i          `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- My Stupid Mistake40olcott
7 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i           `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- My Stupid Mistake39Richard Damon
7 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i            `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==038olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i             `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==037Richard Damon
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i              `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==036olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i               `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==035Richard Damon
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==034olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                 `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==033Richard Damon
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                  `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==032olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                   `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==031Richard Damon
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                    `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==030olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                     `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==029Richard Damon
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                      `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==028olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                       `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==027Richard Damon
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                        `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==026olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                         `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==025Richard Damon
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                          `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==024olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                           `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==023Richard Damon
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                            `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==022olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                             `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==021Richard Damon
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                              `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==020olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                               `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==019Richard Damon
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==018olcott
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                 +* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==02wij
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                 i`- Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==01olcott
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                 `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==015Richard Damon
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                  `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==014olcott
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                   `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- HHH(DDD)==013Richard Damon
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                    `* HHH(DDD)==012olcott
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                     +* Re: HHH(DDD)==08Mikko
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                     i`* Re: HHH(DDD)==07olcott
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                     i +* Re: HHH(DDD)==05Richard Damon
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                     i i`* Re: HHH(DDD)==04olcott
10 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                     i i +- Re: HHH(DDD)==01Richard Damon
10 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                     i i `* Re: HHH(DDD)==02Mikko
10 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                     i i  `- Re: HHH(DDD)==01olcott
10 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                     i `- Re: HHH(DDD)==01Mikko
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                     `* Re: HHH(DDD)==03Richard Damon
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                      `* Re: HHH(DDD)==02olcott
9 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     i                                       `- Re: HHH(DDD)==01Richard Damon
7 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i     `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!3Mikko
7 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i      `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!2olcott
8 Oct 24 ii  i  i   i       `- Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!1Richard Damon
4 Oct 24 ii  i  i   `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now --- different execution traces have different behavior !!!2joes
3 Oct 24 ii  i  `- Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now1Richard Damon
2 Oct 24 ii  `- Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now1olcott
1 Oct 24 i`* ChatGPT correctly analyzed the first page of my paper:11olcott
2 Oct 24 +- Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now1Richard Damon
2 Oct 24 `* Re: Even Google AI Overview understands me now6Mikko

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