Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?

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Sujet : Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?
De : richard (at) *nospam* damon-family.org (Richard Damon)
Groupes : comp.theory
Date : 10. Jun 2025, 01:22:06
Autres entêtes
Organisation : i2pn2 (i2pn.org)
Message-ID : <7dd88603962329e970c50d13e929270ef12134ef@i2pn2.org>
References : 1
User-Agent : Mozilla Thunderbird
On 6/9/25 5:14 PM, olcott wrote:
The official "received view" of this is that the best
we can possibly do is to do nothing and give up.
 void DDD()
{
   HHH(DDD);
   return;
}
 The *input* to simulating termination analyzer HHH(DDD)
specifies recursive simulation that can never reach its
*simulated "return" instruction final halt state* because
this input specifies that HHH simulates itself simulating DDD.
 *Every rebuttal to this changes the words*
 
No, the input does NOT specify that, it specifies that HHH is to decide what a program that calls HHH will do. This means that HHH has to have already been defined as to what its algorithm is exactly. And thus the actual behavior of this action is fulled defined. The problem is that any HHH that uses your logic, gets the wrong answer.
Only if HHH is defined to just simulate its input do you get that implication, but then, as you have shown, such an HHH just fails to be a decider.
The best answer for a "termination analyzer" to do for the pathological case IS what you reject, admit that it can not get a correct answer, and report that. The best answer for the above DDD, is to recognize the pattern (if possible) and see that returning 1 would be correct.
It is a lot better than lying and giving the wrong answer.
All you are doing is showing that you fundamentally don't understand the meaning of the words you are using, ESPECIALLY the meaning of a "Program" as used in the context, and related words like "correct".

Date Sujet#  Auteur
9 Jun 25 * What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?22olcott
10 Jun 25 +- Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?1Richard Damon
10 Jun 25 `* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?20Mikko
10 Jun 25  +* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?6olcott
10 Jun 25  i+- Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?1Richard Damon
11 Jun 25  i`* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?4Mikko
11 Jun 25  i `* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?3olcott
11 Jun 25  i  +- Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?1Richard Damon
13 Jun 25  i  `- Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?1Mikko
10 Jun 25  `* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?13olcott
10 Jun 25   +* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?11Richard Damon
10 Jun 25   i+* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?2olcott
11 Jun 25   ii`- Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?1Richard Damon
11 Jun 25   i`* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?8Richard Damon
11 Jun 25   i +* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?2olcott
11 Jun 25   i i`- Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?1Richard Damon
11 Jun 25   i `* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?5Richard Damon
12 Jun 25   i  +* Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?2olcott
12 Jun 25   i  i`- Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?1Richard Damon
12 Jun 25   i  +- Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?1joes
12 Jun 25   i  `- Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?1Richard Damon
11 Jun 25   `- Re: What is the best way for termination analyzers to handle pathological inputs?1Mikko

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