Re: did this group die?

"Tom Elam wrote on Mon, 4 Nov 2024 08:42:11 -0500 :

Just a few replies.
 
I dropped my iPad 9 and cracked the screen. AppleCare+ replaced the iPad.

Hi Tom Elam,
You don't seem to be like an Apple zealot so I converse with you assuming
you own adult assessment skills (which is a normal way of conversing).

All phones come with an initial free warranty from the OEM & the seller.

And trust me, I *use* those free warranties! It's well known on this
newsgroup T-Mobile gave me a handful of free Samsung Galaxy A32-5G phones
in April of 2021, and within the two year warranty period, I broke two of
them. And T-Mobile replaced both. For free. I'm on the third one still.
 <https://i.postimg.cc/YC1B906F/tmopromo01.jpg> A32-5G & iPhone 12 contract
 <https://i.postimg.cc/Xq5SpS4D/tmopromo02.jpg> $15/mo iPhone,$0/mo Android
 <https://i.postimg.cc/nhpbcP50/tmopromo04.jpg> $100 for 6 lines + $16 fees

All under the seller's warranty. I didn't even have to go to Samsung.

When T-Mobile replaces a phone under warranty, they insist (rightly so) on
seeing the old phone in person (at the T-Mobile store - which is similar in
concept but not in implementation to your vaunted "Apple Store").

They charged me $20 for the first & $25 for the second (prices went up).
But wait. I complained that it's not my fault the phone broke.

So they credited me the amount ahead of time (before I even went to the
T-Mobil Store (which is akin to your beloved "Apple Store" in this case).

Free phone. Free replacement. Multiple free replacement. Under warranty.
Free warranty too!

The Genius Bar people are incredibly helpful. I took an AirTag in that
had stopped working. The tech checked it and recommended a different
battery brand. That fixed it.

I never disagree with someone whose assessments are based on fact.

I fully agree the Genius Bar blueshirts are "incredibly helpful" indeed.
I've set up many an appointment for my aging aunt, for example, there.

She *loves* visiting them as they are patient with her & explain it all.
I can't do that with her. She drives me nuts. All those dumb questions.

It's like she didn't live through the computer age that we all lived in.

I started in the sixties with computers - and we didn't have Genius Bar
help then - where I learned to figure things out when they didn't work.

There is no doubt of the veracity of your assessment that the Genius Bar
employees are "incredibly helpful" in testing your device (but only in the
way they're taught to test it) and in recommending an Apple replacement.

No doubt about it.
They are incredibly helpful in testing & recommending a new device.

That's their job, by the way.
They're salesmen too.

Do you doubt my assessment?
Well then, are you aware of what has been in the news for many years?

Apple even got sued over that exact practice we both agree on Apple does.
Apple was even accused of a crime for exactly that same practice too.

And Apple paid the fine for both of those (which is well known).
a. One was half a billion dollars in settlement agreement.
b. The other was a paltry few million dollars for the crime.
c. But Apple had to publicly admit (for only 30 days) that they did it.

After the 30 days expired, Apple took down the ad on their main French
website that they had committed the crime and that they'd not do it again.

This is well known  as we've discussed this upmpteen times on this ng.

I bought a M1 Macbook and it bricked after 14 days. The Genius Bar tech
offered to get it fixed but I asked for and received a full refund.

Again, I don't doubt the veracity of your fact above, but I might question
your elation on the assessment that the Genius Bar is who did that for you.

I bought a ton of iPads and Android tablets at Costco, for example.
And I can return them for a "full refund" within three months.

Three months is way better than your measly two weeks, right?
No questions asked.

In California, you can get a full refund after you buy a phone for a month
(I think it's a month - but it could be only half a month).

No questions asked.

My point is I don't doubt the accuracy of your fact; I simply state your
assessment that it's anything unusual to refund your money in full after a
measly two weeks when I can get that same refund for much longer.

Without the Genius Bar being involved at all.

As for software and hardware support Apple far surpasses Android.

Again, I ask you to question your assessment since I probably own more
Apple mobile devices than you do, so I'm well aware of their support.

I've worked with computers since the sixties so I'm not fooled at all by
Apple's rather clever advertising on support. I happen to know the facts.

What you are doing is you parrot exactly what Apple told you to parrot.
But parroting Apple propaganda requires you to back up that propaganda.

Let me ask you some simple factual questions to test your knowledge:
Q: How many years does Apple have a written promise to support iPhones?
   [Please put a single-digit number of years here = ?]
Q: How many years does Google have a written promise to support Pixels?
   [Please put a single-digit number of years here = ?]
Q: How many years does Samsung have a written promise to support Galaxies?
   [Please put a single-digit number of years here = ?]

Since two of those numbers are the same, we're only looking at two numbers.
What are they?

Apple full support = ?
Google/Samsung full support = ?

When you fill in that single digit, come back and tell us which company has
the *worst support* in that mix. Tell us if it is Apple or Google/Samsung.

 But you don't have to believe me.

If you're not an Apple troll like Jolly Roger, nospam, Lewis, JF Mezei,
Alan Baker, Alan Browne, Chris, Haemactylus, Joerg Lorenz, et. al, then
you will realize that I'm a normal person who believes in facts.

My assessments are based on facts. Not (rather clever) Apple propaganda.
Facts.

As such, unlike the Apple trolls listed above, I *click* on all URLs.
And I read them. Most importantly, I *understand* what they say.

So let's click on your URL you scoured the Internet to find. Shall we?

https://news.techable.com/apples-software-support-for-iphones-how-long/
"Apple typically provides iOS updates for iPhones for about six to eight
years. For example, the iPhone 15 series, released in September 2023, is
expected to receive updates until 2031. Similarly, the iPhone 14 series,
launched in 2022, will be supported until 2029. Older models like the
iPhone 8 and iPhone X, released in 2017, have recently reached the end
of their update cycle as of 2023.

Jesus Christ. Did you even *read* your own cite before you suggested it?
Seriously.

The fact is Apple has the *worst hotfix support* in the computer industry.
Bar none.

That's just a fact.
It's not propaganda.

No common consumer operating system has worse support than Apple.
None.

Everyone is better. By far. Linux. Android. Windows. All of them.

You don't know the difference between "support" & "full support" do you?
You don't have a clue, right?

And yet, the difference between "support" & "full support" is astounding.

Do you know Android typically provides updates to *all* Android phones over
Android 10 over the Internet - every single month - that's "support".

That's *billions* of Android phones being updated every single month.
Forever. There is no End of Life (EOL) date. That's "support" for you.
And even if there was an EOL date from Google - it's all open sourced.

Likewise, do you know that Microsoft provides "support" for Windows 10
since, oh, I don't know, basically fifteen years ago if you count that the
operating system was updated for free since around about then.

But even if you only count Windows 10, and if you limit the years to "full
support", it's still clear Windows kicks everyone's ass, even Android.

Google and Samsung promise 7 years of full support. It's in writing.
Everyone knows this.

Apple promises only 5 years of full support. That's in writing too.
Everyone (but you) knows this too.

Please learn the difference between "support" & "full support" please.

In *both* cases, Apple's "support/full support" is the worst of all.
Look it up. We've discussed this many times on this newsgroup alone.

Apple's support isn't limited to just software updates. The company also
offers hardware support for about five to seven years after the last
sale date of the product. This means users can get their devices
serviced or repaired at Apple Stores and authorized service providers
during this period. This dual support system ensures that iPhones remain
functional and secure long after their initial release'.

The fact is nobody's "support" is "limited to just software updates".
Not Microsoft. Not Google. Not Samsung. Not Apple.

Windows has "hardware support" for over fifteen years for example.
They're called drivers.

The fact you don't know the difference is probably why you parrot
propaganda which is fed to you by Apple (rather clever) marketing.

Learn to understand facts.

Apple's promised full support is only five years. Face it. That's a fact.
Google & Samsung promise seven years of full support. That's just a fact.

Microsoft doesn't promise, but they've fully supported Windows 10 since
forever, so both the 5 & 7 years of phones pales in comparison to PCs.

You clearly do not have a college degree because in order to pass any test,
you need to be able to differentiate between things like mere "support"
(which Apple's is the *worst* in the industry on) and "full support"
(which, interestingly, Apple is still the *worst in the industry* on).

Stop parroting Apple propaganda.
State the facts.

Most Android manufacturers, including major brands like Samsung and
Google, typically offer around three to four years of updates.

Remember I said all your assumptions were based on old data.
Hence, remember I said everything you said is wrong?

Well, it's wrong again.
Look it up.

We've discussed this many times on Android & Apple newsgroups.
Google/Samsung both promise in writing 7 years of full support now.
Apple only promises five in writing.

With those current facts, whom do you think now has the *worst* support?

For
instance, Google's Pixel phones have started to offer five years of
updates, but this still falls short of Apple's standard. OnePlus offers
three years of major updates and four years of security updates, while
Motorola and Sony lag behind with even shorter support periods''."
https://www.businessinsider.com/guides/tech/iphone-vs-android

As I repeatedly have shown to you, all your data is old.
So all your assessments are wrong.

Google & Samsung both promise in writing 7 years of full support.
Apple only promises five.

Those are facts.
An adult makes his own assessments based on facts.

Not propaganda.
Please stop parroting Apple's (rather clever) propaganda.

I do have a college degree. A few of them. I'm not stupid.
You can't pass those hard tests parroting mere marketing propaganda.
 

"Apple has a consistent history of keeping older iPhone models secure
against common security threats."

And yet, everyone knows that Apple has more exploits than Android.
Lots more.

Again, that's just a fact.
It's a government statistic that is updated every single day by CISA.

All you do is parrot Apple's (rather clever) advertising propaganda.
You don't know any facts.

Hence your assessment of Apple security is not based on the fact that Apple
has more zero-day exploits than Android - by far - that's just a fact.

We've covered this many times in this newsgroup. Look it up.

"Android manufacturers have a comparatively poor history of keeping
their phones supported with software and security updates."
 
"Apple keeps more generations of iPhones supported with security updates
than any Android phone maker we know about."
 
But facts will never convince you.

And yet, my assessments are based on the facts.
Yours are based on old facts.

All your assessments, by the way, Tom Elam, were true years ago.
But they're all wrong now.

Please base your assessments like an adult bases his assessments upon.
Facts.

Also, please learn the difference between "support" (which every computer
manufacturer does) and "full support" (both of which it turns out, Apple
has the *worst in the industry* on). Those are just facts, Tom Elam.

Facts we've covered in tremendous depth on this newsgroup many times.