Re: 25 Classic Books That Have Been Banned

On Sat, 31 May 2025 02:06:47 +0100, Peter Fairbrother
<peter@tsto.co.uk> wrote:

On 30/05/2025 17:05, Paul S Person wrote:
>

"Freedom from religion" is a dogma of one or another of the religions
that deny their own nature.

>
I don't really understand that, but I think it's freedom _of_ religion,
in the Constitution.  However, at least to some extent, one implies the
other.

The part you removed without notice distinguished between the two.
"Freedom from religion" is quite commonly heard from certain groups.

Take the Supreme Court decision on abortion as an example. Perhaps those
judges with strong religious views in the subject should have recused
themselves.

/That/ is a very hard question. The actual issue was whether abortion
was allowed under a particular Amendment. At the time, some pointed
out that it might still be allowed under a different Amendment, but
that legal theory has yet to be tested.

The rest of us * now have to comply with their religion. Is that not
forced participation?

Only in Republican-controlled States. In the sane States, we have to
comply with a secular religion that allows abortion -- with whatever
limits, if any, that religion desires.

IMO you can't have freedom of religion without freedom from religion.

If you check back, you will see that my assertion is that pretty much
everying has a religion. Some have a religion that denies it's own
nature, so they believe (as an article of their religion) that they do
not have one.

The bigger point is that, when these people try to convince people
acting and believing explicitly based on religion by claiming to
produce "facts" instead of "fantasies", it doesn't work because
religious people recognize religion, even when it denies itself, and
resist conversion.

I am, IOW, trying to determine /why/ all those efforts to convince
people of really good ideas fail. And I think I have found it.

"Freedom from forced participation" is a valid concern, but why limit
it to religion? Why not include, say, pep rallies?

Interesting that changing the topic from "religion" to "forced
participation" produces ... nothing.

* the rest of you, actually, as thank Goodness, I am not an American.
But I have friends who are.

--
"Here lies the Tuscan poet Aretino,
Who evil spoke of everyone but God,
Giving as his excuse, 'I never knew him.'"