Re: (ReacTor) Counting the Days: Five SFF Approaches to Calendars

On 22/06/2025 20.45, Tony Nance wrote:

On 6/20/25 2:50 PM, Michael F. Stemper wrote:

On 18/06/2025 21.32, Tony Nance wrote:

On 6/18/25 10:20 AM, James Nicoll wrote:

Counting the Days: Five SFF Approaches to Calendars
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So many different ways of measuring history and the passage of time...
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https://reactormag.com/counting-the-days-five-sff-approaches-to- calendars/

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Asimov’s Foundation series used Galactic Era and Foundation Era, depending on the work. Trantor used GE. Terminus used FE. I don’t remember when GE starts. FE starts in something like 12000GE, tied to the start of the Encyclopedia Foundation.

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According to stuff that I teased out of _Forward the Foundation_ some years
back, Seldon died in 12,069 GE, which was also 1 FE. So, presumably, FE started
in 12068 GE.

Nice. Thanks for tracking all that down.

I got so engrossed in "what did the calendars look like?" that I
forgot about the point of James' post, which was more along the
lines of "when was the year zero/one?" To make up for that:
Middle Earth:
The events that we see in _The Lord of the Rings_ all take place
in the Third Age. Obviously, if there was a Third Age, there must
have been First and Second Ages.
Appendix B does not say when the First Age began. It does, however,
tell us that:
   The _First Age_ ended with the Great Battle, in which the
   Host of Valinor broke Thangorodrim and overthrew Morgoth.
The Second Age ended, and the Third Age began, in SA 3441, when:
   Sauron overthrown by Elendil and Gil-galad, who perish.
The next transition is complicated:
   The _Third Age_ came to its end in the War of the Ring, but
   the _Fourth Age_ was hot held to have begun until Master
   Elrond departed ...
So, the Third Age ended on 25 March, TA 3019, but its successor
did not start until 21 September, TA 3021. What did they do
during that 18-month interregnum? The hobbits, of course, ate
and drank a lot, as if it was an extended Overlithe.
Speaking of the hobbits, although the other Free Peoples all
recognized these Ages, the hobbits had their own "freedom
calendar', which started in TA 1601, when a bunch of them
left Bree, crossing the Baranduin (presumably to preserve
the way of life to which they wished to become accustomed).
So, although Dwarves, Elves, and Men all considered the (latest)
downfall of Sauron as happening in TA 3019, the hobbits (at
least those who could be bothered to care about such foreign
events) saw it as happening in SR 1419.
Imperium/Foundation:
The Trantorian Empire used GE (Galactic Era) dating, which started
with the accession of some brutal lout of the Kamble Dynasty to the
Imperial throne.
The Foundation switched from GE to FE (Foundation Era) some time
after the breakup of the Periphery. The year 1 FE was the year
of Seldon's death, and most likely the founding of the Foundation.
We have the equivalence 1 FE == 12069 GE.
However, with the breakup of the Periphery (and of the Empire as a
whole), other starting points also came into use. Per Chapter 16
of _Second Foundation_, there were at least:
   GE: Galactic Era
   AS: After Seldon (starting from his birth)
   YF: Year of the Foundation (presumably, the same as FE)
   FC: First Citizen (from the creation of that office by the Mule)
However, we can't really get any valid relationships between these,
since the Good Doctor says that the war between Kalgan and the
Foundation started in 11,692 GE, which was before the Foundation was
established. Centuries before.
I just noticed that it was 377 years before the Foundation was set
up. It's possible that, since other text[1] says that the war started
in 377 FE that Dr. A. simply subtracted instead of adding. If
that's so, then it really started in 12446 GE. If my hypothesis is
correct, then we can relate eras as follows:
   12446 GE = 419 AS = 348 YF = 56 FC
Although this blows my idea that YF was another term for FE right
out of the water.
[1] Quotation from the _Encyclopedia Galactica_ that starts Chapter 19.

I'd forgotten all of that. It has probably been 30+ years since I last read The Lord of the Rings. I should read it again some time.

Well, I find it rewarding every time. Of course, the last time that you
read it was about when I set myself the rule of always waiting at least
twelve months between successive readings of it.
--
Michael F. Stemper
Outside of a dog, a book is man's best friend.
Inside of a dog, it's too dark to read.