Re: General Motors quietly closed the door this week on a goal to make only electric vehicles by 2035.

On 7/17/2025 9:06 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:

AMuzi <am@yellowjersey.org> wrote:

On 7/17/2025 6:29 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:

Catrike Ryder <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:

On Wed, 16 Jul 2025 22:44:32 -0000 (UTC), Beej Jorgensen
<beej@beej.us> wrote:
>

In article <1ltf7klta5gi28vbqbas3ckg16at9ivk7s@4ax.com>,
Catrike Ryder  <Soloman@old.bikers.org> wrote:

I just sold my 16 year old, 107K mile Nissan Frontier with a 4 Litre
V6 for $5K I suspect it will retail for twice that. I wonder what a 16
year old EV with a depleted battery is worth.

>
Tough to go back 16 years for EVs, but Carfax has a 2015 Tesla Model S
with 170,000 miles for $9,999. A 2014 with 58,000 miles is listed for
$15,970.

>
I wouldn't touch the 170K Tesla for any price, but the 58K car might
have some miles left on the batteries, but I wouldn't buy it.
>
Here's a 2015 Nissan Frontier with 68,666 miles for $17,995. I'll bet
the Tesla cost a lot more new then the Frontier so it's depreciated
more. The Frontier also has many more miles in it's future than the
Tesla. I liked my 2009 Frontier and I would have kept it for the rest
of my remaining life if it had a decent back seat.
>
--
C'est bon
Soloman
>

>
With batteries the designs are apparently getting better about degrading,
it’s quoted that relatively few batteries are available for recycling as
they are largely still in the cars, remember that this reboot of the
electric cars is fairly young.
>
And indeed the choice of EV’s isn’t great unless all you want is a SUV are
a few Pickups to be fair but estates for example you have 1 choice though
believe more are coming.
>
Ie it’s a moving target as more choice and the design improves.
>
Which is clearly expensive so if manufacturers in some markets can delay or
rather keep selling old technology that has good profits margins they’d be
foolish from a economic standpoint not to take that approach which is what
they are doing.
>
Roger Merriman
>

>
+1
Yes, that is a question with no definitive answer:
>
https://www.motortrend.com/features/how-long-does-a-tesla-battery-last
>
Then again it's a significant expense when/if needed:
https://www.recurrentauto.com/research/tesla-battery-replacement-costs
>
I see Mercedes is testing a race car with modular changeable
(pit stop quick) battery packs, but for many designs,
including Tesla, the battery unit with many cells is a
structural member and as such not trivial to replace.
>

 Yup most go for the “skateboard” frame design hence SUV being a good choice
for EV’s. The idea of swapping batteries doesn’t seem to realistically take
off.
 Are some local ish some non electric lines (trains) that companies are
experimenting with battery powered trains, apparently works well, clearly
an option for some uses, Buses are routinely EV’s now which makes for a
nicer experience ie not sitting in a rattling bus!
 Re Tesla and their market share, they had almost the entire US EV market so
even without Musk and old products line ups and so on, you’d expect the
proportion to drop as other companies catch up, as ever the danger of the
1st to market!
 For example HMS Dreadnought was ordered after Japan and US which both where
building All big gun battleships, but UK industrial production being what
it was, HMS Dreadnought was built and commissioned first, and became the
name for the new concept.
 Roger Merriman

True for all technologies.
Just because the physics is workable, general adoption greatly depends on the economics, scale, logistics etc of fuel and service maintenance:
https://www.stellantis.com/en/news/press-releases/2025/july/stellantis-discontinues-hydrogen-fuel-cell-technology-development-program
--
Andrew Muzi
am@yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971