Re: New York's Crackdown on Ebikes

Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

On 5/26/2025 1:15 PM, NFN Smith wrote:

Frank Krygowski wrote:

New York Times article on police cracking down on ebike traffic
violations. Let's see if this will get people past the paywall:
 
https://www.nytimes.com/2025/05/24/nyregion/ebikes-scooters-cyclists-
nyc.html?unlocked_article_code=1.KE8.voH2.AOcHv0jrnp79&smid=url-share
 
 

 
Ignoring the political drivel of the story...
 
The problem is with classifying ebikes as "bikes" (e.g. 2 wheels) rather
than accounting the dynamics of a powered vehicle.
 
When it comes to bicycles, it's too easy to consider a traditional bike
to be a "pedestrian", because it's slower than a motor vehicle, and is
not powered. However a lot of the time, traditional bikes and
pedestrians are incompatible sharing the same space.

 
I agree. In bike advocacy discussions, I've heard very competent people
point out that bikes and pedestrians mix badly. It can be OK with
conscientious cyclists and sensible pedestrians, but both are often absent.

Even at worse they mix better than motorists do!

Very much depends on the location and situation, the park paths and so on,
I use for the commute differ to the cycleway I use which has occasional
foot traffic, to the newer cycle infrastructure.

In terms of expectations and speed etc wildly varying.

I’d again say you get what you design for.

 

I've found that even
multi-use paths are frequently not a good place for serious riding,
because of the speed differential between a bicycle and a pedestrian.

 
Yes. I've heard the term "pathlete" applied derisively to bicyclists
doing speed work on multi-use paths.

I’ve not really noticed that, but UK and London is lot more accessible for
bicycling than the US, more some runners who are using somewhat
inappropriate places, or times of day etc.

 

And there's even an in-between space for things like unpowered scooters
or roller blades that are faster than pedestrians but slower than bikes.
 
However, with ebikes (and for that matter, powered scooters) when you
add powered propulsion, then you're adding an extra measure of speed,
including that too many ebikes are capable of speeds in excess of what
is possible than for all but the fastest fitness riders.

 
And it's been pointed out that to ride at 20 mph, most people require
years of training. They start slow and tend to make most of their
mistakes at slow (less dangerous) speeds. But ebikes allow total novices
to ride faster than most experts.

This I’d and UK law would class as a moped and should be considered as
such, at that point particularly with a throttle! It fails the does it walk
and talk like a duck? Which the pedal assist 15mph cut off do.

 

I'm fully of the opinion that any bike should be regarded as a vehicle,
and generally, ridden on streets, where it's understood by both the
rider and motorists that the bike is subject to all the rules of the
road, both rights and responsibilities.  Yet at the same time, I
recognize there are combinations of road and bike (and rider) that are
incompatible with each other.  It's not unlike trying to drive a Ferrari
in a school zone, or taking an antique Model-T Ford out onto a freeway.
 
However, the issue with the ebikes is the question of speed, as well as
the understanding of the rules of the road.  With a motorcycle, it's
normally necessary to have licensing, both for the bike and the
operator. Somehow, it seems to have not occurred that just because the
propulsion system of an ebike is electrical rather than an internal
combustion engine that the ebike should not be subject to the same rules
as the motorcycle, rather than being regarded in the same light as an
unpowered bicycle, simply because it has two wheels.

 
All true. Regarding the "somehow" - the crazy legal situation arose, as
I understand, from intense lobbying by bicycle industry lobbyists. They
always need "the next big thing" to save their industry, and they
realized that if ebikes needed licensing and were prohibited from bike
lanes and paths, that they would sell far fewer of them.
 
And here we are.
 

Most lobbyists and companies such as Bosch are very much not in favour of
higher power, for the above reasons see UK Government suggesting to
increase power and EU talking of stricter regulations as DIGI have been
pushing the limits with 1000watt boosts and so on.

Aka they will get banned from stuff and so on.

Roger Merriman