Re: Commuter innovation

On 4/4/2024 7:48 AM, Zen Cycle wrote:

On 4/3/2024 3:33 PM, Frank Krygowski wrote:

 I'm not cherry picking. Regarding bad design or bad maintenance, I'm describing what I've seen and what data has revealed in countless cities.

 You cherry picked one article that you thought supported your position, and as Jeff pointed out, the article didn't do a very good job of it. If you're relating 'data from countless cities', we have yet to see any evidence of it.

My main position is that no amount of bike infrastructure will get a significant number of Americans to switch from cars to bikes. Here's evidence:
https://bikeleague.org/sites/default/files/LAB_Where_We_Ride_2016.pdf
When Phoenix's 0.6% bike mode share gets it ranked among "Cities with the most bicyclists," that says a lot.
Statewise, in that 2016 data Oregon led with 1.7%. But that's probably dropped since, because it was dominated by Portland, where cycling has recently dropped sharply. A typical state's bike mode share is 0.4%

The fundamental fact is, so few people are interested in ditching their cars that it's foolish for municipal governments to spend real money on either design or maintenance. Funds are limited and budgets are real, so corners are cut.
>
And about design: Many starry-eyed facility advocates say "It's so easy!" But totally separate bike paths are impossible in almost all locations, because commercial land (i.e. where people actually need to go) is already owned by someone, and is very valuable. There are rare exceptions (apparently your embankment is one), but pretending that's somehow normal is blatant cherry picking.

 It's neither rare, nor an exception, nor cherry picking from Rogers experience, and is well supported by the many other Europeans who post in this forum describing the government run infrastructure supporting bike lane use, _successfully_.

There are European successes, particularly in flat northern cities with mild climate and high density, leading to very short average trips. As I recall, the typical Amsterdam bike ride stretches about three miles and takes something like 20 minutes. The typical American commute is around 20 miles one way and averages about half an hour by car.
There are also European failures. There are the English "new towns" like Stevenage designed specifically to make cycling super convenient, but where cars still dominate. And there's a fairly vocal British contingent who say "Why can't we be like Amsterdam???" (Britain overall has just a 2% bike mode share.)

We get it. You hate cycling infrastructure. You think it's a waste of time and money, and consider it to be inherently unsafe and unworkable.

That's not far off. Most of it is not hugely dangerous, primarily because bicycling is immensely safe. But most bike lanes don't measurably increase safety, and they actually add complication and danger to intersections. Some have greatly increased crash counts.
And if their objective is to get lots more people riding instead of driving, yes, they are failures.
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- Frank Krygowski