Re: RE: Re: Machine Shop

On 3/3/2025 9:38 AM, cyclintom wrote:

On Sun Feb 23 13:05:12 2025 John B.  wrote:

On Sat, 22 Feb 2025 20:04:09 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:
>

On Sun, 23 Feb 2025 07:26:05 +0700, John B. <slocombjb@gmail.com>
wrote:
>

On Sat, 22 Feb 2025 13:06:13 -0800, Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com>
wrote:
>

On Sat, 22 Feb 2025 19:58:29 GMT, cyclintom <cyclintom@yahoo.com>
wrote:
>

On Fri Nov 8 14:03:46 2024 Frank Krygowski  wrote:

It doesn't exist, Tom. You can't pop a dent out a bicycle frame tube by
riding the bike. Thinking you can is a sign of insanity.

>
If you have a slight dent in high performance steel. the tubing can revert to its natural shape under stress.

>
Tom.  The only steel that might do that is spring steel (1095, 1060,
1075, 1080, etc).  Bicycle frames are not made from spring steel.  If
they were made from spring steel, they would ride like the proverbial
wet noodle.

>
Errr... 1095 is not "spring steel". At least not in the metal working
field. It is simply a high carbon steel and one common use is knife
blades and other cutting devices :-)

>
True, but I beg to differ slightly.  Wikipedia lists 1095 as "Blue, or
polished bright spring steel".  Same with McMaster-Carr catalog:
<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spring_steel>
<https://www.mcmaster.com/catalog/116/3630>
>
During the 1960's, I was working in my father's lingerie factory after
school.  We couldn't afford a resident toolmaker to build the sewing
machine attachments.  So, I was volunteered to do the work.  My father
took home a few tools and some stock including a box of assorted coils
of spring steel.  When he died in 1995(?), I inherited the tools and
metal stock which included some 1095 coils and scrap.
>
However, it seems that it's also suitable for knives.  I know a little
about knife making and sharpening.  I made one knife from a kit:
<https://www.knifekits.com>
I do fairly well (for a beginner) at sharpening.  1095 is considered a
good steel for knifemaking because of it's edge retention.  It's most
suitable for survival knives.  1095 has no corrosion resistance and
therefore poor edge retention in corrosive environments:
<https://www.bladehq.com/blog/knife-steel-guide#1095>

>
You can make a knife out of a rock if that is all you have so lets not
get carried away :-)
>
Like most things the material used to make a knife is largely
dependent on what you intend to use it for.
And before we get further, I spent quite a bit of my life working with
metals, from forging and  making knives from old files to managing a
machine shop where far more modern steels are used in jet engines and
that sort of thing
  And yes there are steels to make different knives, and over the years
I've made a lot of knives ranging from my wives kitchen knives to a
"special" hunting knife for my Father's Christmas present, and not to
mention all the shop cutting tools over the years.
>
To my mind a "good knife" is a knife that works well for the use that
you intend to use it for. My wife's (she's gone now) are still in the
kitchen and still work as well as they did when I made then nearly 30
years ago,  she complained of a store bought knife and I, foolishly,
made her a good carbon-steel knife and went from being "Master of the
House" to "kitchen knife maker" over night :-(
>

For bicycle frame use, it could probably survive a crash, but will
corrode away in the first rain.  If the tubing were thin enough, it
might be springy enough for self healing dents.  However, the same
springiness will also provide a springy ride.

>
And, no bicycle frames are not made from knife quality carbon steel
although it could be that when I as a lad bike frames might well have
been made of low carbon tubing as from memory they did bend a lot in a
crash.

    Didn't you just learn that liebermann believes that "spring steel" tubing isn't proper material for a bicycle tube which requires the tubular shape for the proper strength and not material?
 And he no doubt will tell you that a file is spring steel.
 I am having a hard time dealing with people who have never accomplished a thing in their lives telling people with actual experience that they don't know what they're talking about.

There are many subjects here on RBT to which I do not contribute as I know nothing in the area.
But deformation of steel bicycle tubing is a subject on which I am an actual expert.
--
Andrew Muzi
am@yellowjersey.org
Open every day since 1 April, 1971