Re: When is fat too fat?

Zen Cycle <funkmaster@hotmail.com> wrote:

On 3/24/2025 8:54 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:

zen cycle <funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:

On 3/24/2025 8:01 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:

zen cycle <funkmasterxx@hotmail.com> wrote:

On 3/24/2025 7:43 AM, Roger Merriman wrote:

Frank Krygowski <frkrygow@sbcglobal.net> wrote:

On 3/22/2025 11:10 PM, zen cycle wrote:

 
At any rate, yes, there seems to be more and more vindication for wider
tires and the bikes needed to support them as time goes on. It's amazing
how I was brought into the racing world being told skinny high-pressure
tires were the way to go, while older school people back when I started
were pooh poohing the idea. I remember one old codger at the local time
trial in the 1980s saying that skinny tires should only be used on the
track (he was the last guy to show up at the TT with wooden rims). It
seems like we should have taken his word back then.

 
AFAIK, the trend toward accepting the benefits of wider tires was
started by Jan Heine with his coast down tests on outdoor soapbox derby
tracks. He pointed out that those tests were more representative of real
world riding than were the smooth rolling drum tests of the day. And he
was inspired to do the tests by his fascination with French
randonneuring bikes of the '50s and '60s.

 
I’d suggest this is rather self promotion on his part as ever, wider tyres
and disks came with the use of CX bikes, and CX bikes sold with the
expectation of being used for commuting or hacking around the woods, than
being used as CX race.
 
Early turn of the century or so, the Specialised Tricross is one bike I
remember from that time.
 
Took a while for manufacturers to realise what the bikes were being used
for, and even longer for racers who have resisted wider tyres/discs etc all
the way.

 
The speed benefits are usually explained by less energy transmitted to
the rider's flesh, where it is lost (and adds discomfort). In this
forum, I remember Jobst rather fiercely defending rolling drum data, and
saying that those energy losses should not be considered part of rolling
resistance.
 
That may be a semantic argument. It's clear those losses are real, and
they need to be considered _somewhere_.
 
 

I’d argue that speed shouldn’t be anyone’s sole concern.

 
For some, it is, with justification.
 
https://efprocycling.com/tips-recipes/this-is-how-wider-tyres-and-rims-can-make-you-faster/
 

 
Even for pro racers comfort ie other factors come into play, ie having a
wider tyres even if largely neutral in rolling resistance, not getting so
fatigued and so on.
 
And that’s road, let alone the Gravel races and so on

 
My feeling is that if it makes them faster, they'll put up with the
discomfort.
 

Probably yes, see the aero positions they train to hold and so on.
 
Though would seem to be that getting fatigue from the discomfort is slower
so unless it’s quite short, comfort is worth considering which is kinda
full circle!

 
A decade ago Tony Martin was the worlds preeminent time trialst with 4
world champion titles between 2011 and 2016. He was also know for always
willing to try something new. One of his biggest issues was sliding
around on the saddle which he felt robbed him of power and efficiency,
so he took a novel approach - sand paper.
 
For the 2015 World Championships in Richmond, VA, he glued a sanding
cloth onto his saddle. Unfortunately, he neglected to consider what 53
Km of time trialing on sandpaper would to his shorts, and ultimately his
skin.
 
"But towards the end of the 53.5km course; in the battle between
sandpaper and Martin’s shorts, the sandpaper prevailed."
 
https://www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/tony-martins-sandpaper-bum-wound-a-most-unusual-injury/
 
A note for the squeamish - there are pictures.
 
 

Heh! I’d forgotten about that! Definitely outlier behaviours and rather
focused!

Roger Merriman