Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice

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Sujet : Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice
De : muratlanne (at) *nospam* gmail.com (Jim Wilkins)
Groupes : rec.crafts.metalworking
Date : 31. May 2025, 13:00:35
Autres entêtes
Organisation : A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID : <101er1t$13trq$1@dont-email.me>
References : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
User-Agent : Microsoft Windows Live Mail 16.4.3505.912
"Richard Smith"  wrote in message news:m1iklhuoo1.fsf@void.com...
50% faster would generally be without unsought thrills?
YOu could go a bit faster as a test with everything out of the way, then
settle on what you want?
----------------------
That's a question to ask the motor manufacturer. More speed gives greater iron loss heating and greater centrifugal force on the rotor assembly components. I haven't yet abused motors; measuring the frequency response of Variacs showed me that they were closely designed for their rated frequency, losses rose and efficiency dropped rapidly above 60Hz, even at low voltage. I had considered using them in speaker crossover networks. Also applying more than the rated voltage to Variacs and transformers increases the iron loss by increasing the magnetic field strength above its design limit. The loss is visible as an increase in no-load current, which is proportional to voltage below the design limit and rises sharply above it.
For example I saw twice the no-load loss in a welding transformer at 130V as at 120V. At 140V 750W out required around 1000W in. 140V could come from a motor speed regulated gasoline generator set to deliver 110V at full load.
https://www.portescap.com/en/newsroom/whitepapers/2022/10/how-iron-losses-directly-influence-the-selection-of-a-bldc-motor
https://darwinmotion.com/blogs/what-is-v-hz-control-mode-for-ac-drives
The reason is because the current through the winding inductance rises with increasing AC voltage but falls with rising frequency. The V/Hz ratio controls the current which produces useful torque and damaging heat.
A motor's rotation makes it a generator whose voltage output opposes the power supply and thus limits the current to what the load requires. As the load slows the motor it generates less "back" voltage and allows more current, which permits the motor to drive the load, within design limits.
The 220V grinder motor I tested drew 4A, twice the rating, when stopped with 120V applied. When it reached full speed the current into the Variac driving the grinder was around 0.3A.
A simple analog current meter is enough to watch for excessive current draw when experimenting. Measuring the power consumed requires a more sophisticated meter that separates "real" from "apparent" power, Watts from Volt-Amps.
https://www.allaboutcircuits.com/textbook/alternating-current/chpt-11/true-reactive-and-apparent-power/

Date Sujet#  Auteur
7 Apr 25 * rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice56Richard Smith
7 Apr 25 +- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Leon Fisk
7 Apr 25 +- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
8 Apr 25 `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice53Jim Wilkins
14 Apr 25  `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice52Richard Smith
14 Apr 25   +- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
14 Apr 25   `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice50Jim Wilkins
15 Apr 25    +* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice42Richard Smith
15 Apr 25    i+* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice37Jim Wilkins
20 Apr 25    ii`* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice36Jim Wilkins
21 Apr 25    ii `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice35Richard Smith
21 Apr 25    ii  `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice34Jim Wilkins
22 Apr 25    ii   `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice33Richard Smith
22 Apr 25    ii    +* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice30Jim Wilkins
29 May 25    ii    i`* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice29Richard Smith
29 May 25    ii    i `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice28Jim Wilkins
30 May 25    ii    i  `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice27Richard Smith
30 May 25    ii    i   +* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice2Jim Wilkins
30 May 25    ii    i   i`- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
30 May 25    ii    i   `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice24David Billington
31 May 25    ii    i    +* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice22Richard Smith
31 May 25    ii    i    i+- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
31 May 25    ii    i    i+- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1David Billington
1 Jun 25    ii    i    i`* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice19Jim Wilkins
18 Jun 25    ii    i    i `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice18Richard Smith
18 Jun 25    ii    i    i  +- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
18 Jun 25    ii    i    i  +- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
18 Jun 25    ii    i    i  `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice15David Billington
18 Jun 25    ii    i    i   `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice14Jim Wilkins
18 Jun 25    ii    i    i    `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice13David Billington
19 Jun 25    ii    i    i     +- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
19 Jun 25    ii    i    i     `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice11Jim Wilkins
23 Jun 25    ii    i    i      `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice10Richard Smith
23 Jun 25    ii    i    i       `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice9Jim Wilkins
23 Jun 25    ii    i    i        `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice8Richard Smith
23 Jun 25    ii    i    i         `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice7Jim Wilkins
24 Jun 25    ii    i    i          +* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice5Richard Smith
24 Jun 25    ii    i    i          i`* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice4Jim Wilkins
24 Jun 25    ii    i    i          i `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice3Richard Smith
24 Jun 25    ii    i    i          i  `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice2Jim Wilkins
26 Jun 25    ii    i    i          i   `- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Richard Smith
24 Jun 25    ii    i    i          `- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Richard Smith
31 May 25    ii    i    `- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Richard Smith
22 Apr 25    ii    +- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
22 Apr 25    ii    `- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
15 Apr 25    i+- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
15 Apr 25    i`* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice3Jim Wilkins
16 Apr 25    i `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice2Richard Smith
16 Apr 25    i  `- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
16 Apr 25    `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice7Richard Smith
16 Apr 25     `* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice6Leon Fisk
16 Apr 25      +- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
16 Apr 25      +* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice3Jim Wilkins
17 Apr 25      i`* Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice2Leon Fisk
17 Apr 25      i `- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Jim Wilkins
21 Apr 25      `- Re: rod-mill project - "mains" electric motor advice1Richard Smith

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