Re: OT: Cracking Speech by JDV!

On 2/24/2025 3:09 AM, Liz Tuddenham wrote:

Don Y <blockedofcourse@foo.invalid> wrote:
 

But, YOU determine your sexual preferences, sexuality, gender, etc.
You might "leak" hints to careful observers, but YOU are the defining
entity.  Whereas, in each of the preceding, you are likely the LAST
to know (or admit).
>
[That's not to say that there aren't folks who refuse to acknowledge
their own preferences -- likely because they KNOW there are social
(and likely business/economic) consequences to that!]

 That is the critical point: there is what you are - and there is what
you do about it.   Like left-handedness, trying to suppress something
that is part of who you are will eventually take its toll on your
well-being.

For me, as an observer, there is a more fundamental issue...
I was raised to ferret out my own "truth" as my folks were unable
to keep up with the variety of questions I would pose (even as a
youth).  So, I was encouraged to read, research, explore, etc.
(the number of times folks came home to a smoke-filled house
always tested their commitment to this approach!)
So, when I learned that my best friend was a "Methodist", it
was up to me to figure out what that meant and how *I* felt about
it:  "He *looks* like me, so how does 'methodistism' manifest?"
As a result, I spent a lot of time QUESTIONING people who were
"different" -- methodists, presbyterians, jews, irishmen, poles,
lawyers, doctors, carpenters, etc.  *I* had to gather the data
and then make sense of it.
This has persisted throughout my life.  Imagine asking a black
friend what it means to be black.  (!)  Or, a woman, what it
feels like to be a woman.  Or a gay man/woman.  etc.
[The one situation that I have shied away from is asking friends
who are "actively dying" (circle-the-drain) what THAT feels like.
It just seems WAY too personal -- even for tested friendships!]
While many of these things are elective (one CHOOSES to be a
carpenter -- "if so, why?"), it is relatively easy to understand
the rationales that folks offer to your inquiries.
And, religious issues are most often inertial -- folks just continue
along the trajectory set out by their parents, never really questioning
it (or why).  So, "lazy thinking" catches a lot of reasoning.
But, sexual preference wasn't something that anyone could provide
a "reason" to explain.  It wasn't a choice (except, perhaps, for
bisexuals/pansexuals?) but, rather, a part of who they were.
So, I couldn't understand the *why* of their "decision" -- because it
wasn't a decision (the only decision being how they handled it).
In that way, it was similar to my questions of blacks, women, etc.:
they could tell me what it was LIKE to be that way, but not how
they *got* there.
If you, then, turn your questions inward and ask how YOU got to
<wherever>, you realize that you likely had no choice, either.
So, the logical conclusion is just to accept people for what they
are, without requiring their "justification" (unless I would be
able to justify what *I* am!).
Amusingly, this seems to be very difficult for people.  They seem
to *crave* sameness.  "Different" is scary.  And, different without
a reason that THEY can accept is scarier still!
E.g., my sleep-wake schedule is all over the map.  I sleep when I
am tired and wake when I am rested.  Most folks have a tough time
adjusting to this:  "Can you have Don give me a call, when he gets
up?" -- not "Is Don there?" as I am *likely* not awake.  (I discarded
my business phone ages ago because clients would call WHEN CONVENIENT
FOR THEM, of course, and find me likely asleep.  "Let's do everything
via email so we have a *record* of the conversation -- instead of
relying on my summary notes -- and we can each THINK about it
instead of wanting instant answers")
I have 7 identical T-shirts, one of which I wear each day.  So, it
looks like I've never changed clothes!  This distresses folks -- even
those who have SEEN those 7 shirts on hangers.
   "How could you wear the same shirt every day?"
   "But, it's NOT the same shirt!"
   "You know what I mean... it LOOKS the same as the one you wore
    yesterday and the day before and the day before..."
   "Why does it have to LOOK different?  I am 'presentable'; my
    body protected from the sun, I am clean, etc."
This an outgrowth of standardizing on a few different color socks,
many years ago -- "Is this black or navy?  Hmmm... this one has a
red stripe, where is it's mate?"
[I now have ONE color of socks -- all the same make/model so they
"pair" effortlessly!]

The link which was identified between mental illness and LGBT in the
past  was not because more LGBT people were mentally ill, it is because
of the way they were treated by society and the stress they were under
to appear to conform.

Exactly.  "Why can't you write with your RIGHT HAND like the rest of us?"
(Is there some *reason* that this would be desirable?   Save for the fact
that lefties end up seated at the corners on large dinner tables to
avoid elbow clashes)

Very often the most anti-LGBT people are like that because they are
trying to suppress it in themselves.

I'm not qualified to speak on that.  OTOH, there was a "pastor" at
a local "church" (that used to advertise on TV!) who was very anti-gay.
And, a casual assessment (90+ people out of 100) would lead you to
believe HE was gay -- he even made a comment to that effect in one
of his TV commercials!  <rolls eyes>
I *do* think folks who try to be something that they are not tend
to have "issues".  And, often lash out at others, needlessly
(like drunks who rage about random things, unprovoked)

I know many trenswomen who wasted
the first part of their lives pretending to be macho men, grew beards
and did weight training etc in the hope that it would make the feelings
go away.  Often this led to multiple breakdowns and/or attempts at
suicide before they eventually recognised their self deception and
decided to live the rest of their lives the way they needed to.

I'd say, "put yourself in their shoes" but realize that would be
a silly assertion.
Anyone who is honest with themselves would acknowledge that being
a *woman* (cis or trans) has a significant downside.  That someone
would WANT to "masquerade" as such (to address the imagined issue
that trans people are so by deliberate choice) is silly.
As with women, black, etc., I can't discover any reasoning to
explain why someone is what they are.  Like friends who can't
understand why I wear the same shirt or sleep weird hours
(even though I *can* explain those behaviors).
If I can't handle their reality, then the problem lies in *me*,
not them.
But, many people suffer from "lazy thinking".  Look at how many
folks cling to one way of solving a problem -- despite better
ways being available; they just don't want to THINK about those
things because it is "work" to do so (or, they are afraid that
they will fail).  A version 27 is much easier to deal with than
version 1 (of something NEW)!

There is a bit of good advice given to parents who are frantically
worried that their young son might be transgender: "Better a happy
daughter than a dead son".  Sadly, this advice isn't always heeded.

I have a friend/neighbor with young kids.  I've known them virtually
their whole life.  When they would drive by, they would yell out
to me "Hi, Don!" -- an adult who treated them like "real people"
(instead of little kids).
When I last saw one of the boys, he (?) was sporting shoulder length
hair -- and earrings (he is probably 8yo?).  Of course, young boys
have feminine features, high pitched voices, etc.  So, easy for
him to be seen as a girl -- if that was his intent.  *My* only comment
was to drool over how lustrous his hair was.
Thankfully, I always address them -- and reference them -- by their
first names; so, the whole pronoun issue was avoidable.  But, "his"
parents are responsible for his upbringing, not me.  Whether this
is a fad or representative of his true feelings is not for me to say.
OTOH, if he truly *is* wanting to be treated as a "girl", then I will
have to adjust my relationship with him to reflect that.  Out of
respect to *him*.
It's up to his parents to sort out how the other kids/neighbors/etc
deal with him.