Re: Grand Apagon - Electricity (not) in Spain

On 2025-04-30 20:47, john larkin wrote:

On Wed, 30 Apr 2025 12:41:24 +0200, "Carlos E.R."
<robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
 

On 2025-04-30 11:59, Liz Tuddenham wrote:

Bill Sloman <bill.sloman@ieee.org> wrote:
>

... pumped hydro storage has the spinning
turbines, but grid scale batteries have invereters, which can reacta lot
faster than any spinning turbine,

>
I thought the stabilising effect of a spinning turbine was because it
*didn't* react quickly.
>
The grid frequency begins to fall so energy from the moving parts is
converted to electrical power which is fed into the grid to increase.
the frequency.  This results in a loss of stored mechanical energy which
causes the turbine to begin slowing down - which is detected by the
control system and used to feed more water/gas/steam into the turbine so
its speed is returned to normal.

>
I understand that the turbine doesn't actually slow down, because the
generator starts working as a synchronous motor drawing energy from the
network instead; this is detected by the control system and feeds more
water/gas/steam, etc.
>
As long as the network keeps the frequency.
>
>

>
The interface between the stored mechanical energy and the electrical
energy demand has an almost instant response and is inherently stable
without needing elaborate control algorithms.
>

 Certainly a power network has to handle millisecond disturbances, but
the bigger problem with green energy is the issue of having not enough
power for hours or days. That requires nearly 100% fossil-fueled hot
standby, or impractical masses of batteries.
 Really, nukes and natural gas power plants are clean and just work.
That's why greenies hate them.

Nukes didn't actually work. They fell sooner out of the network that was falling, they did not help to avoid the falling. And they were the last to be connected back on the recovery procedure.
And no, they are not clean. They produce very dangerous waste that has to be managed, and nobody has yet found a way to do that.
They are not even profitable.
--
Cheers, Carlos.