Inertia and third principle

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Sujet : Inertia and third principle
De : fortunati.luigi (at) *nospam* gmail.com (Luigi Fortunati)
Groupes : sci.physics.research
Date : 22. Jun 2024, 03:16:01
Autres entêtes
Organisation : A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID : <v5357b$31hot$1@dont-email.me>
In my animation https://www.geogebra.org/m/gxqwmxah at the moment of
the collision the F1 and F2 forces of action and reaction between the
two bodies A and B are activated.

Is it true that force F1 is the sum of the blue forces of the particles
of body A and force F2 is the sum of the red forces of the particles of
body B?

Could the forces F1 and F2 exist if the blue and red forces of the
particles of bodies A and B did not exist?

Luigi Fortunati

[[Mod. note -- At the moment of collision, the only impact forces are
those on the parts of the bodies which are in contact (labelled as points
A and B in your very nice animamation).  These then propagate pressure
waves into the bodies, which apply forces on the rest of the bodies.
So, the small red and blue arrows which your (very nice!) animation
shows as being applied to each mass point of bodies A and B at the
moment of collision are wrong -- the actual forces are very non-uniform
across each body (as well as being highly time-dependent).

Here's an article with actual data of this sort:
  Ross, Patel, and Wenzel
  "Vehicle Design and the Physics of Traffic Safety"
  Physics Today vol 49 (Jan 2006), pages 49-54
The /Physics Today/ article is behind a paywall, but as of a few minutes
ago google scholar says there's a free copy at
  https://people.cas.uab.edu/~nordlund/Courses/PH201/Links/vol59no1p49_54.pdf
The article has two graphs showing velocity as a function of time for
various parts of cars during car crashes.  You can clearly see how
different parts of a car have different velocity profiles, and hence
different accelerations.

But, I think the answer to your first question may still be "yes".  After
all, ultimately the net force on body A is the sum of all the forces on
A's individual mass points, and similarly for B.

As for your second question, suppose that instead of two solid bodies,
you just had a pair of clouds of dust moving towards each other.  Then
they'd interpenetrate and basically go right through each other, so
the "impact" forces F1 and F2 would both be zero.
-- jt]]

Date Sujet#  Auteur
22 Jun 24 * Inertia and third principle20Luigi Fortunati
24 Jun 24 `* Re: Inertia and third principle19Luigi Fortunati
29 Jun 24  `* Re: Inertia and third principle18Luigi Fortunati
6 Jul 24   `* Re: Inertia and third principle17Luigi Fortunati
9 Jul 24    `* Re: Inertia and third principle16Luigi Fortunati
15 Jul 24     `* Re: Inertia and third principle15Luigi Fortunati
22 Jul 24      `* Re: Inertia and third principle14Luigi Fortunati
31 Jul 24       `* Re: Inertia and third principle13Luigi Fortunati
3 Aug 24        `* Re: Inertia and third principle12Luigi Fortunati
4 Aug 24         `* Re: Inertia and third principle11Mikko
6 Aug 24          `* Re: Inertia and third principle10Luigi Fortunati
8 Aug 24           `* Re: Inertia and third principle9Luigi Fortunati
8 Aug 24            +- Re: Inertia and third principle1Luigi Fortunati
8 Aug 24            `* Re: Inertia and third principle7Mikko
8 Aug 24             `* Re: Inertia and third principle6Luigi Fortunati
13 Aug 24              `* Re: Inertia and third principle5Luigi Fortunati
13 Aug 24               `* Re: Inertia and third principle4Luigi Fortunati
15 Aug 24                `* Re: Inertia and third principle3Mikko
23 Aug 24                 `* Re: Inertia and third principle2Luigi Fortunati
24 Aug 24                  `- Re: Inertia and third principle1Mikko

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