Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages

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Sujet : Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages
De : rweikusat (at) *nospam* talktalk.net (Rainer Weikusat)
Groupes : comp.unix.shell comp.unix.programmer comp.lang.misc
Date : 10. Oct 2024, 17:55:32
Autres entêtes
Message-ID : <87o73rj3sr.fsf@doppelsaurus.mobileactivedefense.com>
References : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9
User-Agent : Gnus/5.13 (Gnus v5.13) Emacs/27.1 (gnu/linux)
Muttley@DastartdlyHQ.org ignorantly rambled:
On Thu, 10 Oct 2024 16:09:49 +0100
Rainer Weikusat <rweikusat@talktalk.net> boring babbled:
Muttley@DastartdlyHQ.org writes:
Its syntax is also a horrific mess.
>
Which means precisely what?
>
Far too much pointless punctuation. An interpreter shouldn't need the vartype
signified by $ or @ once its defined, it should already know.

For the purpose of variable declaration, how's the interpeter going to
know the type of a variable without being told about it? Obviously, not
at all.

Perl has three builtin types, scalars, arrays and hashes and
each is denoted by a single-letter prefix which effectively creates
three different variable namespaces, one for each type. That's often
convenient, because the same name can be reused for a variable of a
different type, eg:

my ($data, @data, %data);

$data = rand(128);
@data = ($data, $data + 1);
%data = map { $_, 15 } @data;

it's also convenient to type and easy to read due to being concise.

Outside of declarations, $ and @ really denote access modes/ contexts,
with $ standing for "a thing" and @ for "a number of things", eg

$a[0]

is the first element of the array @a and

@a[-3 .. -1]

is a list composed of the three last elements of @a.

And then there  are semantically meaningful underscores (seriously?)

Similar to the number writing convention in English: 1,600,700, numbers
in Perl can be annotated with _-separators to make them easier to
read. Eg, all of these are identical

1_600_700
16_007_00
1_6_0_0_7_0_0_

But the underscores have no meaning in here.

and random hacky keywords  such as <STDIN>.

<STDIN> isn't a keyword. STDIN is the name of a glob (symbol table
entry) in the symbol table of the package main. It's most prominent use
is (as they name may suggest) to provide access to "the standard input
stream".

<> is an I/O operator. It's operand must be a file handle, ie, either
the name of glob with a file handle associated with it like STDIN or a
scalar variable used to hold a file handle. In scalar context, it reads
and returns the next line read from this file handle. In list context,
it returns all lines in the file.

Eg, this a poor man's implementation of cat:

perl -e 'open($fh, $_) and print <$fh> for @ARGV'

 I could go on.

Please don't enumerate everything else on this planet you also don't
really understand as that's probably going to become a huge list. ;-)

Date Sujet#  Auteur
29 Mar 24 * Command Languages Versus Programming Languages750Lawrence D'Oliveiro
29 Mar 24 +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1candycanearter07
29 Mar 24 +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages170Muttley
29 Mar 24 i+- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Josef Möllers
29 Mar 24 i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages9Richard Kettlewell
29 Mar 24 ii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages8Muttley
29 Mar 24 ii `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages7Kaz Kylheku
29 Mar 24 ii  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages6Muttley
29 Mar 24 ii   `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages5Kaz Kylheku
30 Mar 24 ii    `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4Muttley
30 Mar 24 ii     +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Janis Papanagnou
30 Mar 24 ii     `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Kaz Kylheku
1 Apr 24 ii      `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Muttley
29 Mar 24 i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages159John Ames
29 Mar 24 i +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages157Muttley
29 Mar 24 i i+- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1John Ames
29 Mar 24 i i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages151Kaz Kylheku
29 Mar 24 i ii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages150Muttley
29 Mar 24 i ii +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages148Kaz Kylheku
29 Mar 24 i ii i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4David W. Hodgins
29 Mar 24 i ii ii+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Johanne Fairchild
30 Mar 24 i ii iii`- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1David W. Hodgins
30 Mar 24 i ii ii`- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Janis Papanagnou
30 Mar 24 i ii i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages143Muttley
30 Mar 24 i ii i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages142Kaz Kylheku
1 Apr 24 i ii i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages141Muttley
1 Apr 24 i ii i   +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages139Johanne Fairchild
1 Apr 24 i ii i   i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages138Muttley
1 Apr 24 i ii i   i +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kaz Kylheku
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages136Johanne Fairchild
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages115ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de (Stefan Ram)
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i  i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages112Stefan Ram
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i  ii+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages110Stefan Ram
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages109Lawrence D'Oliveiro
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages108David Brown
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii  +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii  +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1John Ames
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages105Keith Thompson
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages100Richard Kettlewell
4 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i+- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Muttley
4 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages98Stefan Ram
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages97Lawrence D'Oliveiro
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages49Muttley
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3candycanearter07
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  ii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Muttley
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  ii `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1candycanearter07
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages45Lawrence D'Oliveiro
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages44Alan Bawden
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages13Lawrence D'Oliveiro
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages12John Ames
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages11Lawrence D'Oliveiro
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages9John Ames
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages8Richard Kettlewell
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Janis Papanagnou
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i i`- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Richard Kettlewell
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages5David Brown
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4Lawrence D'Oliveiro
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i   `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3David Brown
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i    `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Lawrence D'Oliveiro
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i     `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kaz Kylheku
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kaz Kylheku
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3Kaz Kylheku
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2David Brown
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Muttley
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1candycanearter07
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages26Muttley
7 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages22Alan Bawden
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages21Muttley
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages20David Brown
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages19Muttley
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i   +* Words to the wise (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)2Kenny McCormack
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i   i`- Re: Words to the wise (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)1Muttley
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i   `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages16Kaz Kylheku
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    +* Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)9Kenny McCormack
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i`* Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)8Janis Papanagnou
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i +- Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)1D
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i `* Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)6candycanearter07
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i  `* Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)5Janis Papanagnou
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i   +- Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)1candycanearter07
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i   `* Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)3Lawrence D'Oliveiro
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i    +- Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)1Chris Elvidge
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i    `- Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)1candycanearter07
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages6Muttley
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i     +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kaz Kylheku
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i     +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Janis Papanagnou
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i     `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3Muttley
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i      `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2John Ames
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i       `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Muttley
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   +- [meta] Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Janis Papanagnou
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Keith Thompson
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i    `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kenny McCormack
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages47Janis Papanagnou
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages27Stefan Ram
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4Muttley
7 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   ii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3Lawrence D'Oliveiro
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   ii `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Muttley
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   ii  `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   i+- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Janis Papanagnou
6 Aug 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages21Sebastian
7 Aug 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages20Lawrence D'Oliveiro
7 Aug 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3Kaz Kylheku
8 Aug 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4Andreas Eder
25 Aug 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages12Sebastian
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kaz Kylheku
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i   `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages18Lawrence D'Oliveiro
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4David Brown
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i  ii`- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kaz Kylheku
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i  i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Kaz Kylheku
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages20Lawrence D'Oliveiro
1 Apr 24 i ii i   `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
1 Apr 24 i ii `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Andreas Eder
29 Mar 24 i i+- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Christian Weisgerber
30 Mar 24 i i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2David Brown
30 Sep 24 i i`- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Bozo User
29 Mar 24 i `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kaz Kylheku
29 Mar 24 +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages554Johanne Fairchild
29 Mar 24 +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2David Brown
29 Mar 24 +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages15Lawrence D'Oliveiro
30 Mar 24 +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3Dmitry A. Kazakov
30 Sep 24 `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4Bozo User

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