Sujet : Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ -- key details
De : richard (at) *nospam* damon-family.org (Richard Damon)
Groupes : comp.theory sci.logicDate : 01. Jun 2024, 20:45:59
Autres entêtes
Organisation : i2pn2 (i2pn.org)
Message-ID : <v3ftpn$2n53n$13@i2pn2.org>
References : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33
User-Agent : Mozilla Thunderbird
On 6/1/24 3:26 PM, olcott wrote:
On 6/1/2024 1:52 PM, joes wrote:
Am Sat, 01 Jun 2024 09:37:01 -0500 schrieb olcott:
On 6/1/2024 2:52 AM, Mikko wrote:
On 2024-05-31 15:35:18 +0000, olcott said:
>
*A quick summary of the reasoning provided below*
The LHS is behavior that embedded_H is allowed to report on.
There is no restrictions on what embedded_H is allowed to report on.
>
embedded_H is only allowed to report on the behavior that its finite
string Turing Machine Description specifies to a UTM.
>
embedded_H <is> a UTM except that it stops simulating and reports
non-halting as soon as it correctly recognizes a non-halting behavior
pattern that is specified by its input.
"Except". So it is not an UTM.
>
When Ĥ is applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩
Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* embedded_H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.qy ∞
Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* embedded_H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.qn
>
(a) Ĥ copies its input ⟨Ĥ⟩
(b) Ĥ invokes embedded_H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩
(c) embedded_H simulates ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩
(d) simulated ⟨Ĥ⟩ copies its input ⟨Ĥ⟩
(e) simulated ⟨Ĥ⟩ invokes simulated embedded_H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩
(f) simulated embedded_H simulates ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩
(g) goto (d)
>
embedded_H is not allowed to be applied to Ĥ ⟨Ĥ⟩ because inputs can
only be finite strings and Ĥ is not a finite string. This means
that embedded_H is not allowed to report on its own actual behavior.
I can't read that notation. What is H^ and what does it look like?
>
*Here is the whole Linz proof*
I simplified the Linz notation at the bottom of page 2 of the proof.
https://www.liarparadox.org/Linz_Proof.pdf
Yes, you "simplified" it by removing essential parts of the requirements listed.
Probably because you don't understand what they mean, because requirements don't seem to mean anything to you.
Date | Sujet | # | | Auteur |
23 May 24 | Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 186 | | olcott |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 23 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 10 | | olcott |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 9 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 8 | | olcott |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 7 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 6 | | olcott |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 5 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 4 | | olcott |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 3 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 2 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 1 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 12 | | Fred. Zwarts |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 5 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 4 | | olcott |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 3 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 2 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 1 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 6 | | olcott |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 5 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 4 | | olcott |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 3 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 2 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 1 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 154 | | Fred. Zwarts |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 153 | | olcott |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 152 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 151 | | olcott |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 150 | | Richard Damon |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 149 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 1 | | Richard Damon |
25 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 147 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 146 | | Richard Damon |
25 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 145 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 144 | | Richard Damon |
25 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 143 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 140 | | Richard Damon |
25 May 24 | D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 139 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 138 | | Richard Damon |
25 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 137 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 134 | | Richard Damon |
25 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 133 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 132 | | Richard Damon |
25 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 131 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 130 | | Richard Damon |
25 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 129 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 128 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 6 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 5 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 4 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 3 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 2 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 1 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 121 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 120 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 119 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 118 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 117 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 116 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 115 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 114 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 113 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 112 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 2 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 1 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 109 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 108 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 6 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 5 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 2 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 1 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 2 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 1 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Dishonest? | 101 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Dishonest? | 100 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Dishonest? | 99 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Dishonest? | 98 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Dishonest? | 97 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Dishonest? | 96 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- | 95 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- | 94 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- | 93 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- | 92 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Linz proof | 4 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Linz proof | 3 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Linz proof | 2 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Linz proof | 1 | | Richard Damon |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Linz | 87 | | olcott |
26 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 --- Linz | 86 | | Richard Damon |
27 May 24 | A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 85 | | olcott |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 84 | | Richard Damon |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 83 | | olcott |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 82 | | Richard Damon |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 4 | | olcott |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 3 | | Richard Damon |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 2 | | olcott |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 1 | | Richard Damon |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 77 | | olcott |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 3 | | Richard Damon |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 2 | | olcott |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 1 | | Richard Damon |
27 May 24 | Re: A simulating halt decider applied to the The Peter Linz Turing Machine description ⟨Ĥ⟩ | 73 | | olcott |
25 May 24 | Re: D correctly simulated by pure function H cannot possibly reach its, own line 06 | 2 | | Alan Mackenzie |
26 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 2 | | Fred. Zwarts |
24 May 24 | Re: Can you see that D correctly simulated by H remains stuck in recursive simulation? | 8 | | Mikko |