Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1 --- STA

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Sujet : Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1 --- STA
De : mikko.levanto (at) *nospam* iki.fi (Mikko)
Groupes : comp.theory
Date : 03. Apr 2025, 07:42:17
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On 2025-04-03 01:19:43 +0000, olcott said:

On 4/2/2025 1:47 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
Op 02.apr.2025 om 17:55 schreef olcott:
On 4/2/2025 9:14 AM, joes wrote:
Am Mon, 31 Mar 2025 16:26:58 -0500 schrieb olcott:
On 3/31/2025 2:10 PM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
Op 31.mrt.2025 om 20:16 schreef olcott:
 
A simulating termination analyzer is always correct to abort the
simulation and reject the input as non-halting when-so-ever this input
would otherwise prevent itself from halting.
 
But the input is halting, as proven by direct execution.
 Something other than the input is halting.
HHH1(DDD) shows the same behavior as the direct execution.
   HHH(DDD) shows the behavior of the actual input.
Why are you not passing DDD as input? Why do you not call what you're
doing HHH(HHH(DDD))? What is the difference in what is passed to HHH1?
 
 This seems to be above your level of technical competence.
 _DDD()
[00002172] 55         push ebp      ; housekeeping
[00002173] 8bec       mov  ebp,esp  ; housekeeping
[00002175] 6872210000 push 00002172 ; push DDD
[0000217a] e853f4ffff call 000015d2 ; call HHH(DDD)
[0000217f] 83c404     add  esp,+04
[00002182] 5d         pop  ebp
[00002183] c3         ret
Size in bytes:(0018) [00002183]
 Anyone understanding the above code where HHH
emulates DDD according to the semantics of the
x86 language knows that this DDD (not some
other different DDD) cannot possibly reach its
own final halt state.
 
Yes it fails to reach the end of the simulation of a program that according to the x86 semantics has an end as proven by direct execution.
 In other words you don't hardly know the x86
language at all.
Although x86 is more complex than a Turing machine and might therefore
seem easier to use for obfuscation it is not really vague enough that
such obvuscation would succeed here.
--
Mikko

Date Sujet#  Auteur
20 Mar 25 * DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined474olcott
20 Mar 25 +* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined435Mikko
20 Mar 25 i`* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined434olcott
21 Mar 25 i +* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined426Richard Damon
21 Mar 25 i i`* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined425olcott
21 Mar 25 i i +* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined421Mikko
21 Mar 25 i i i`* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined420olcott
22 Mar 25 i i i +* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined418Richard Damon
22 Mar 25 i i i i`* DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 2417olcott
22 Mar 25 i i i i +* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 2412Richard Damon
22 Mar 25 i i i i i+* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 25olcott
22 Mar 25 i i i i ii+* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 23Richard Damon
22 Mar 25 i i i i iii`* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 22olcott
22 Mar 25 i i i i iii `- Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 21Richard Damon
22 Mar 25 i i i i ii`- Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 21Mikko
22 Mar 25 i i i i i`* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 2 addendum406olcott
22 Mar 25 i i i i i +* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 2 addendum404joes
22 Mar 25 i i i i i i`* III correctly emulated by EEE ---403olcott
22 Mar 25 i i i i i i +* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---401Richard Damon
22 Mar 25 i i i i i i i`* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---400olcott
23 Mar 25 i i i i i i i +* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---398Richard Damon
23 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i`* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---397olcott
23 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---396Richard Damon
23 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i  `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---395olcott
23 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i   `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---394Richard Damon
23 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i    `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---393olcott
24 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i     `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---392Richard Damon
24 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i      `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---391olcott
24 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i       `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---390Richard Damon
24 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i        `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---389olcott
25 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i         `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---388Richard Damon
25 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          +* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---374olcott
25 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          i+* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---372joes
25 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii`* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---371olcott
25 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---370joes
25 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii  `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---369olcott
26 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   +* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---367Richard Damon
26 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i`* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---366olcott
26 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---365Richard Damon
26 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i  `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---364olcott
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i   `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---363Richard Damon
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i    `* DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1362olcott
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH139Richard Damon
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH138olcott
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i +- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Fred. Zwarts
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH136Richard Damon
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i  +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH12olcott
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i  i`- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Richard Damon
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i  `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH133olcott
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH131joes
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i+* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH12olcott
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   ii`- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Richard Damon
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH128olcott
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH127Richard Damon
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i  `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH126olcott
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH122Richard Damon
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH121olcott
28 Mar14:50 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH120Richard Damon
28 Mar19:13 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i  `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH119olcott
28 Mar22:58 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i   `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH118Richard Damon
28 Mar23:41 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i    `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH117olcott
29 Mar02:05 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i     +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH18Richard Damon
29 Mar03:08 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i     i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH17olcott
29 Mar03:31 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i     i `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH16Richard Damon
29 Mar04:41 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i     i  `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH15olcott
29 Mar11:55 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i     i   `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH14Richard Damon
29 Mar17:45 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i     i    `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH13olcott
29 Mar19:32 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i     i     `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH12Richard Damon
29 Mar21:32 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i     i      `- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Fred. Zwarts
29 Mar10:56 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i     `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH18Mikko
29 Mar16:28 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i      `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH17olcott
29 Mar19:34 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i       +- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Richard Damon
29 Mar21:01 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i       +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH14joes
29 Mar22:34 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i       i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH13olcott
29 Mar23:20 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i       i +- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Richard Damon
30 Mar09:29 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i       i `- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11joes
30 Mar10:16 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   i       `- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Mikko
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i   `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH13joes
28 Mar19:21 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i    `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH12olcott
29 Mar10:48 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   i     `- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11joes
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     i   `- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Richard Damon
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i     `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1322Fred. Zwarts
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i      `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1321olcott
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1304dbush
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1303olcott
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1302dbush
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i  `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1301olcott
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i   `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1300dbush
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i    `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1299olcott
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i     `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1298dbush
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i      `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1297olcott
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH160dbush
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH159olcott
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH142dbush
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH141olcott
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH137dbush
28 Mar18:57 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH136olcott
28 Mar19:07 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i i +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH111joes
28 Mar20:05 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i i i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH110olcott
28 Mar20:17 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i i i +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH13dbush
28 Mar20:28 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i i i i`* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH12olcott
28 Mar23:03 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i i i +- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Richard Damon
29 Mar09:46 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i i i `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH15Fred. Zwarts
28 Mar19:09 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i i +- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Richard Damon
28 Mar19:12 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i i `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH123dbush
28 Mar14:53 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i i `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH13Richard Damon
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH111Fred. Zwarts
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       i `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH15Fred. Zwarts
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       i       `* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH1236Richard Damon
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH17Fred. Zwarts
27 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       +* Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH18joes
28 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   i       `- Re: DDD specifies recursive emulation to HHH and halting to HHH11Richard Damon
26 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          ii   `- Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---1joes
25 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          i`- Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---1Richard Damon
25 Mar 25 i i i i i i i i          `* Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---13olcott
23 Mar 25 i i i i i i i `- Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---1Mikko
23 Mar 25 i i i i i i `- Re: III correctly emulated by EEE ---1Mikko
22 Mar 25 i i i i i `- Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 2 addendum1Richard Damon
22 Mar 25 i i i i `* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined 24Mikko
22 Mar 25 i i i `- Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined1Mikko
21 Mar 25 i i `* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined3Richard Damon
21 Mar 25 i `* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined7Mikko
20 Mar 25 +* Re: DDD correctly emulated by HHH --- Correct Emulation Defined3Richard Damon
22 Mar 25 `* DDD correctly emulated by EEE --- Correct Emulation Defined35olcott

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