Re: Turing Computations <are> finite string transformations of inputs

Liste des GroupesRevenir à theory 
Sujet : Re: Turing Computations <are> finite string transformations of inputs
De : polcott333 (at) *nospam* gmail.com (olcott)
Groupes : comp.theory
Date : 27. Apr 2025, 19:50:10
Autres entêtes
Organisation : A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID : <vulu92$1bf1j$9@dont-email.me>
References : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12
User-Agent : Mozilla Thunderbird
On 4/27/2025 1:27 AM, Fred. Zwarts wrote:
Op 27.apr.2025 om 00:33 schreef olcott:
On 4/26/2025 5:18 PM, André G. Isaak wrote:
On 2025-04-26 15:28, olcott wrote:
On 4/26/2025 4:03 PM, André G. Isaak wrote:
On 2025-04-25 21:28, olcott wrote:
On 4/25/2025 5:28 PM, André G. Isaak wrote:
On 2025-04-25 10:31, olcott wrote:
>
Once we understand that Turing computable functions are only
allowed to derived their outputs by applying finite string
operations to their inputs then my claim about the behavior
of DD that HHH must report on is completely proven.
>
You're very confused here.
>
Computable functions are *functions*. That is, they are mappings from a domain to a codomain, neither of which are required to be strings. Functions don't involve finite string operations at all.
>
>
All Turing Machine based computation applies the/
finite string transformations specified by the TM
language to the input finite string.
>
Turing machines and computable functions are not the same thing. You keep conflating the two. The point of my post was to try to get you to be more careful with your terminology.
>
André
>
>
Yes so I must correct my words to say
>
All Turing Machine based *Computable Functions* apply the
 >> finite string transformations specified by the TM
 >> language to the input finite string.
>
Which is just as mangled as your earlier usage. Maybe learn what these things mean...
>
André
>
>
When HHH emulates DD once and then emulates itself
emulating DD according to the finite string transformation
rules specified by the x86 language then HHH
 should also analyse Halt7.c and conclude that there is a conditional abort, which makes the recursion finite and thus there is no need to abort the simulation. But HHH fails to do this correct analysis and prematurely aborts the simulation.
Now it is clear that correct simulation requires that HHH(DD)
apply the finite string transformations specified by the x96
language to its input the nonsense about directed execution
is finally unequivocally refuted. The first part of the following
is proven to be correct.
The second part is self-evidently correct to several
C programmers, thus HHH is correct to reject DD as non-halting.
<MIT Professor Sipser agreed to ONLY these verbatim words 10/13/2022>
     If simulating halt decider H correctly simulates its input D
     until H correctly determines that its simulated D would never
     stop running unless aborted then
     H can abort its simulation of D and correctly report that D
     specifies a non-halting sequence of configurations.
</MIT Professor Sipser agreed to ONLY these verbatim words 10/13/2022>
--
Copyright 2025 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer

Date Sujet#  Auteur
21 Apr 25 * Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error450Keith Thompson
22 Apr 25 +* Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error442olcott
22 Apr 25 i+- Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error1Richard Damon
25 Apr 25 i`* Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error440olcott
25 Apr 25 i +* Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error195Richard Damon
25 Apr 25 i i`* Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error194olcott
25 Apr 25 i i +* Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error192joes
26 Apr 25 i i i`* Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs191olcott
26 Apr 25 i i i +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1dbush
26 Apr 25 i i i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs188joes
26 Apr 25 i i i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs187olcott
26 Apr 25 i i i i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs185Fred. Zwarts
26 Apr 25 i i i i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs184olcott
26 Apr 25 i i i i i +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1dbush
26 Apr 25 i i i i i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs181Richard Damon
26 Apr 25 i i i i i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs180olcott
26 Apr 25 i i i i i i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs172dbush
26 Apr 25 i i i i i i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs171olcott
26 Apr 25 i i i i i i i `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs170dbush
27 Apr 25 i i i i i i i  `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs169olcott
27 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs137dbush
27 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs136olcott
27 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs134dbush
27 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i i+* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs132olcott
27 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii+* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs5dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i iii`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs4olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i iii +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1joes
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i iii +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Damon
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i iii `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii+- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Damon
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs125Fred. Zwarts
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs124Richard Heathfield
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii  `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs123olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs15dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs14olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs11dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs10olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs7dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs6olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs4dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs3olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i i i +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1dbush
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i i i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Damon
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Damon
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Fred. Zwarts
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Damon
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs2Richard Damon
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i  `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Heathfield
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1joes
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs104Richard Heathfield
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs103olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs14dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++13olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++12dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i  `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++11olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i   `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++10dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i    `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++9olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i     +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++2dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i     i`- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++1Richard Heathfield
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i     +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++1Fred. Zwarts
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i     `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++5Richard Heathfield
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i      `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++4olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i       +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++1dbush
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i       +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++1Richard Heathfield
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i       `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs +++1joes
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions DON'T apply finite string transformations to inputs2Alan Mackenzie
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i i`- Re: Turing Machine computable functions DON'T apply finite string transformations to inputs1olcott
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs86Richard Heathfield
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i  `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT85olcott
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT7dbush
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT6olcott
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Fred. Zwarts
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Richard Heathfield
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Richard Damon
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT2dbush
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i  `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1dbush
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT65Richard Heathfield
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT64olcott
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT48Richard Heathfield
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT47olcott
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT45Richard Heathfield
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT44olcott
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT42Richard Heathfield
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT41olcott
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT39Richard Heathfield
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT38olcott
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT35Richard Heathfield
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i i+* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT15olcott
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i ii+- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Richard Heathfield
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i ii+- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1dbush
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i ii+* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT11Keith Thompson
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i iii`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT10olcott
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i iii `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT9Keith Thompson
1 May 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i iii  +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT5olcott
1 May 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i iii  i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT4Keith Thompson
1 May 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i iii  i `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT3olcott
1 May 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i iii  i  +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1dbush
1 May 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i iii  i  `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Richard Damon
1 May 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i iii  `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT3olcott
1 May 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i iii   +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1dbush
1 May 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i iii   `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Richard Damon
1 May 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i ii`- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Richard Damon
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i i`* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT19Mike Terry
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1dbush
1 May 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Richard Damon
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Fred. Zwarts
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Fred. Zwarts
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Fred. Zwarts
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT14Fred. Zwarts
30 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Richard Damon
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT11joes
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   i   `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs VERIFIED FACT1Richard Damon
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   +- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Fred. Zwarts
29 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i ii   `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Damon
28 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i i`- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Heathfield
27 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Damon
27 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   +* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs7dbush
27 Apr 25 i i i i i i i   `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs24Mike Terry
27 Apr 25 i i i i i i `* Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs7Richard Damon
27 Apr 25 i i i i i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Fred. Zwarts
26 Apr 25 i i i i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Damon
26 Apr 25 i i i `- Re: Turing Machine computable functions apply finite string transformations to inputs1Richard Damon
26 Apr 25 i i `- Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error1Richard Damon
25 Apr 25 i +* Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error21André G. Isaak
26 Apr 25 i `* Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error223Mikko
22 Apr 25 +* Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error4Keith Thompson
22 Apr 25 `* Re: Refutation of Turing’s 1936 Halting Problem Proof Based on Self-Referential Conflation as a Category (Type) Error3Richard Damon

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