Newsportal USENET - Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met

Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met

Sujet : Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met
De : mikko.levanto (at) *nospam* iki.fi (Mikko)
Groupes : comp.theory
Date : 19. May 2025, 11:12:26

Autres entêtes

Organisation : -
Message-ID : <100f06a$1ije7$1@dont-email.me>
References : 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12
User-Agent : Unison/2.2

On 2025-05-18 19:18:21 +0000, olcott said:

On 5/18/2025 2:08 PM, joes wrote:
Am Sun, 18 May 2025 12:28:05 -0500 schrieb olcott:
On 5/18/2025 10:21 AM, Mike Terry wrote:
On 18/05/2025 10:09, Mikko wrote:
On 2025-05-17 17:15:14 +0000, olcott said:

HHH(DDD) does not base its decision on the actual behavior of DDD
after it has aborted its simulation of DDD, instead it bases its
decision on a different HHH/DDD pair that never aborts.
This is why HHH does not satisfy "H correctly determines that its
simulated D would never stop running unless aborted". If HHH bases its
decision on anything else than what its actual input actually
specifies it does not decide correctly.

Right. It seems to be a recent innovation in PO's wording that he has
started using the phrase "..bases its decision on a different *HHH/DDD
pair* ..".

Thus SHD must report on a different SHD/Infinite_Loop pair where this
hypothetical instance of itself never aborts.
This, the simulator. The input still calls the same real aborting HHH.

If H always reports on the behavior of its simulated input after it
aborts then every input including infinite_loop would be determined to
be halting.
Yes, that is why H is wrong.

Instead H must report on the hypothetical H/D input pair where the very
same H has been made to not abort its input.
Just no.

*H correctly determines that its simulated D*
*would never stop running unless aborted*
by a hypothetical instance of itself that never aborts.
H does stop running when simulated without aborting, because it aborts.

H is required to report on the behavior of D in the
case where a hypothetical instance of itself never
aborts its simulated D.
When the hypothetical H never aborts its simulated D then:
(a) Simulated D NEVER HALTS
(b) Executed D() NEVER HALTS
(c) Executed H() NEVER HALTS
(d) Everything that H calls NEVER HALTS

You forgot
(e) H does not report
--
Mikko

Les messages affichés proviennent d'usenet.

Date	Sujet	#	Auteur
15 May 25	Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	220	olcott
15 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	18	olcott
15 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	12	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	7	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	2	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Damon
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	4	Mikko
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	3	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Damon
17 May10:27	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Mikko
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	4	Mikko
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	3	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Damon
17 May10:30	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Mikko
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	5	Mikko
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	4	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Damon
17 May10:35	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Mikko
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	201	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	61	Richard Heathfield
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	60	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	3	Richard Heathfield
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	2	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Heathfield
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	56	Mikko
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	55	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	29	Richard Heathfield
17 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	28	olcott
17 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	6	Richard Damon
17 May03:46	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	5	olcott
17 May03:58	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	4	Richard Damon
17 May04:15	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	3	olcott
17 May09:57	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Fred. Zwarts
17 May13:48	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Damon
17 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	21	Richard Heathfield
17 May03:24	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	20	olcott
17 May03:44	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	15	Richard Heathfield
17 May03:55	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	14	olcott
17 May04:33	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	13	Richard Heathfield
17 May04:49	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	12	olcott
17 May05:09	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	5	Richard Heathfield
17 May05:37	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	4	olcott
17 May05:52	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	3	Richard Heathfield
17 May06:04	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	2	olcott
17 May06:20	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Heathfield
17 May13:59	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	6	Richard Damon
18 May12:09	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	5	Richard Heathfield
19 May10:23	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	4	Mikko
19 May11:08	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	3	Richard Heathfield
19 May13:32	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	2	Mikko
19 May13:57	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Heathfield
17 May03:42	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	4	Richard Damon
17 May05:53	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	3	olcott
17 May09:50	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Fred. Zwarts
17 May13:52	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Damon
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	3	Richard Damon
17 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	2	olcott
17 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Damon
17 May10:42	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	22	Mikko
18 May12:05	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	21	Richard Heathfield
18 May23:18	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	20	Ben Bacarisse
19 May01:01	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	18	Richard Heathfield
19 May01:27	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	17	Ben Bacarisse
19 May01:33	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	16	olcott
19 May02:02	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	14	Richard Heathfield
19 May02:24	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	13	olcott
19 May03:08	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	11	Richard Heathfield
19 May04:16	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	8	Richard Heathfield
19 May05:12	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	7	Richard Heathfield
19 May05:25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	6	olcott
19 May05:57	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	4	Richard Heathfield
19 May06:27	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	3	olcott
19 May07:17	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Heathfield
19 May10:54	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Mikko
19 May12:00	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Damon
19 May10:49	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Mikko
19 May11:56	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Damon
19 May10:41	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Mikko
19 May10:36	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Mikko
19 May10:29	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Mikko
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	5	Richard Damon
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	4	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	3	Richard Damon
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	2	olcott
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	1	Richard Damon
16 May 25	Re: Overcoming the proof of undecidability of the Halting Problem by a simple example in C	134	Mikko
16 May 25	Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	133	olcott
17 May11:06	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	132	Mikko
17 May18:15	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	131	olcott
17 May20:58	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	3	Richard Damon
17 May21:03	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	2	olcott
18 May10:12	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	1	Mikko
18 May10:09	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	127	Mikko
18 May16:21	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	120	Mike Terry
18 May18:28	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	119	olcott
18 May20:08	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	28	joes
18 May20:18	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	27	olcott
18 May20:30	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	1	Richard Damon
19 May11:12	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	25	Mikko
20 May05:10	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	24	olcott
18 May20:25	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	90	Richard Damon
18 May19:36	Re: Mike Terry Proves --- How the requirements that Professor Sipser agreed to are exactly met	6	olcott