Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages

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Sujet : Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages
De : anthk (at) *nospam* disroot.org (Bozo User)
Groupes : comp.unix.shell comp.unix.programmer comp.lang.misc
Date : 30. Sep 2024, 21:04:53
Autres entêtes
Organisation : A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID : <vdf095$2c9hb$6@dont-email.me>
References : 1
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On 2024-03-29, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
At one time, we distinguished between “scripting” languages and
“programming” languages. To begin with, the “scripting” languages were
somehow more limited in functionality than full-fledged “programming”
languages. Or they were slower, because they were interpreted.
>
Then languages like Perl and Java came along: both were compiled to a
bytecode, a sort of pseudo-machine-language, which was interpreted by
software, not CPU hardware. Were they “scripting” or “programming”
languages? Some might have classed Perl as a “scripting” language to
begin with, but given it is must as powerful as Java, then why
shouldn’t Java also be considered a “scripting” rather than
“programming” language? And before these two, there was UCSD Pascal,
which was probably the pioneer of this compile-to-bytecode idea.
>
So that terminology for distinguishing between classes of programming
languages became largely obsolete.
>
But there is one distinction that I think is still relevant, and that
is the one between shell/command languages and programming languages.
>
In a shell language, everything you type is assumed to be a literal
string, unless you use special substitution sequences. E.g. in a POSIX
shell:
>
    ls -l thingy
>
“give me information about the file/directory named ‘thingy’”, vs.
>
    ls -l $thingy
>
“give me information about the files/directories whose names are in
the value of the variable ‘thingy’”.
>
Whereas in a programming language, everything is assumed to be a
language construct, and every unadorned name is assumed to reference
some value/object, so you need quote marks to demarcate literal
strings, e.g. in Python:
>
    os.listdir(thingy)
>
“return a list of the contents of the directory whose name is in the
variable ‘thingy’”, vs.
>
    os.listdir("thingy")
>
“return a list of the contents of the directory named ‘thingy’”.
>
This difference in design has to do with their typical usage: most of
the use of a shell/command language is in typing a single command at a
time, for immediate execution. Whereas a programming language is
typically used to construct sequences consisting of multiple lines of
code before they are executed.
>
This difference is also why attempts to use programming languages as
though they were shell/command languages, entering and executing a
single line of code at a time, tend to end up being more trouble than
they are worth.
>
Conversely, using shell/command languages as programming languages, by
collecting multiple lines of code into shell scripts, does work, but
only up to a point. The concept of variable substitution via string
substitution tends to lead to trouble when trying to do more advanced
data manipulations.
>
So, in short, while there is some overlap in their applicable usage
areas, they are still very much oriented to different application
scenarios.

Check Emacs' eshell where you can mix pseudo-sh code with Elisp

Date Sujet#  Auteur
29 Mar 24 * Command Languages Versus Programming Languages708Lawrence D'Oliveiro
29 Mar 24 +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1candycanearter07
29 Mar 24 +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages19Janis Papanagnou
29 Mar 24 i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages15Lawrence D'Oliveiro
30 Mar 24 ii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages14Janis Papanagnou
30 Mar 24 ii +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3Janis Papanagnou
30 Mar 24 ii i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Keith Thompson
30 Mar 24 ii i `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Janis Papanagnou
30 Mar 24 ii +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages6Lawrence D'Oliveiro
30 Mar 24 ii i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3Keith Thompson
30 Mar 24 ii ii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Lawrence D'Oliveiro
30 Mar 24 ii ii `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Keith Thompson
30 Mar 24 ii i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Janis Papanagnou
30 Mar 24 ii i `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
30 Mar 24 ii +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3Keith Thompson
30 Mar 24 ii i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Janis Papanagnou
30 Mar 24 ii i `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Keith Thompson
31 Mar 24 ii `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
29 Mar 24 i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3Stefan Ram
30 Mar 24 i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Janis Papanagnou
30 Mar 24 i  `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
29 Mar 24 +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages168Muttley
29 Mar 24 i+- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Josef Möllers
29 Mar 24 i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages9Richard Kettlewell
29 Mar 24 ii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages8Muttley
29 Mar 24 ii `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages7Kaz Kylheku
29 Mar 24 ii  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages6Muttley
29 Mar 24 ii   `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages5Kaz Kylheku
30 Mar 24 ii    `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4Muttley
30 Mar 24 ii     +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Janis Papanagnou
30 Mar 24 ii     `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Kaz Kylheku
1 Apr 24 ii      `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Muttley
29 Mar 24 i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages157John Ames
29 Mar 24 i +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages155Muttley
29 Mar 24 i i+- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1John Ames
29 Mar 24 i i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages149Kaz Kylheku
29 Mar 24 i ii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages148Muttley
29 Mar 24 i ii +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages146Kaz Kylheku
29 Mar 24 i ii i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4David W. Hodgins
29 Mar 24 i ii ii+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Johanne Fairchild
30 Mar 24 i ii iii`- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1David W. Hodgins
30 Mar 24 i ii ii`- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Janis Papanagnou
30 Mar 24 i ii i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages141Muttley
30 Mar 24 i ii i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages140Kaz Kylheku
1 Apr 24 i ii i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages139Muttley
1 Apr 24 i ii i   +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages137Johanne Fairchild
1 Apr 24 i ii i   i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages136Muttley
1 Apr 24 i ii i   i +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kaz Kylheku
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages134Johanne Fairchild
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages113ram@zedat.fu-berlin.de (Stefan Ram)
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i  i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages111Stefan Ram
2 Apr 24 i ii i   i  ii+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages109Stefan Ram
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages108Lawrence D'Oliveiro
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages107David Brown
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii  +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Lawrence D'Oliveiro
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii  +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1John Ames
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages104Keith Thompson
3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages99Richard Kettlewell
4 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i+- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Muttley
4 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages97Stefan Ram
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages96Lawrence D'Oliveiro
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages49Muttley
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i+* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3candycanearter07
5 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  ii`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Muttley
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  ii `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1candycanearter07
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages45Lawrence D'Oliveiro
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages44Alan Bawden
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages13Lawrence D'Oliveiro
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages12John Ames
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages11Lawrence D'Oliveiro
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages9John Ames
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages8Richard Kettlewell
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Janis Papanagnou
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i i`- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Richard Kettlewell
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages5David Brown
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4Lawrence D'Oliveiro
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i   `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3David Brown
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i    `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2Lawrence D'Oliveiro
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  i     `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kaz Kylheku
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i  `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Kaz Kylheku
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages3Kaz Kylheku
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages2David Brown
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  i `- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1Muttley
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  +- Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages1candycanearter07
6 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages26Muttley
7 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   +* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages22Alan Bawden
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i`* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages21Muttley
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages20David Brown
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i  `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages19Muttley
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i   +* Words to the wise (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)2Kenny McCormack
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i   i`- Re: Words to the wise (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)1Muttley
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i   `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages16Kaz Kylheku
8 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    +* Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)9Kenny McCormack
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i`* Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)8Janis Papanagnou
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i +- Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)1D
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i `* Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)6candycanearter07
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9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i   +- Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)1candycanearter07
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i   `* Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)3Lawrence D'Oliveiro
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i    +- Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)1Chris Elvidge
10 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    i    `- Re: Phrases that should be banned on Usenet (Was: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages)1candycanearter07
9 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   i  i   i    `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages6Muttley
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3 Apr 24 i ii i   i  iii   `* Re: Command Languages Versus Programming Languages4David Brown
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