Re: ZFC solution to incorrect questions: reject them

On 3/14/2024 9:15 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/14/24 6:12 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/14/2024 8:06 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/14/24 4:45 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/14/2024 5:37 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/14/24 3:04 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/14/2024 4:55 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/14/24 1:59 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/14/2024 3:54 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/14/24 1:26 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/14/2024 3:20 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/14/24 12:32 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/14/2024 12:33 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/13/24 4:04 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/13/2024 5:43 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/13/24 2:54 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/13/2024 4:39 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/13/24 1:52 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/13/2024 12:52 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/13/24 10:08 AM, olcott wrote:

On 3/13/2024 11:44 AM, immibis wrote:

On 13/03/24 04:55, olcott wrote:

On 3/12/2024 10:49 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

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Not quite. It always gets the wrong answer, but only one of them for each quesiton.
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They all gets the wrong answer on a whole class of questions

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Wrong. You said. yourself. that H1 gets the right answer for D.
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Since it is a logical impossibility to determine the truth
value of a self-contradictory expression the requirement
for H to do this is bogus.

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Shows you are just a LIAR, as there IS a truth value to the expression that is the requirment for ANY SPECIFIC H.
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*Lying about me being a liar may possibly cost your soul*
*Lying about me being a liar may possibly cost your soul*
*Lying about me being a liar may possibly cost your soul*
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There is no mapping from H(D,D) to Halts(D,D) that exists.
This proves that H(D,D) is being asked an incorrect question.
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Why, because it is NOT a LIE.
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You don't even know the definiton of an incorrect question.
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I invented it so I get to stipulate its meaning.
https://groups.google.com/g/sci.lang/c/AO5Vlupeelo/m/nxJy7N2vULwJ

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Nope, common technical term.
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Cite a source.
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The fact that there DOES exist a mapping Halt(M,d) that maps all Turing Machines and there input to a result of Halting / Non-Halting for EVERY member of that input set, means tha Halts is a valid mapping to ask a decider to try to decider.
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That part is true.
Likewise when you ask a man that has never been married:
Have you stopped beating tour wife?
There are some men that have stopped beating their wife.

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Right, because that question include a presumption of something not actually present.
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Although there is a mapping from some men to YES/NO
there is no mapping from never unmarried men to YES/NO
thus the question is incorrect for all unmarried men.
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Although there is a mapping from some TM/input pairs to YES/NO
there is no mapping from H/D to YES/NO
thus the question is incorrect for H/D
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Except that the mapping requested is about the INPUTS to H, not H itsef.
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In order to see that it is an incorrect question we must examine
the question in detail. Making sure to always ignore this key detail
<is> cheating.
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Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hq0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hqy ∞ // Ĥ applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩ halts
Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hq0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hqn   // Ĥ applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩ does not halt
∀Ĥ.H (Ĥ.H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ != Halts(⟨Ĥ⟩, ⟨Ĥ⟩))

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Which isn;t the question at all, so you are just shown to be a stupid liar.
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The QUESTION is:
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Does the machine and input described by this input, Halt when run?

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The question posed to Ĥ.H has no correct answer, thus not the
same question at all.

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But it DOES.

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Then tell me which element of:
∀Ĥ.H (Ĥ.H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ != Halts(⟨Ĥ⟩, ⟨Ĥ⟩)) is correct and make sure that
you explain why this element is correct and don't try to switch
to any other element outside of the above specified set.
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I didn't say there was.
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Then you understand that each question posed to each Ĥ.H in the
above set has no correct answer only because each of these answers
are contradicted by the machine that H is contained within.
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No, YOU don't understand that the IS a correct answer, just not the one that H (or H^.H ) happens to give.
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Then show me which contradicted answer is correct.
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If H (H^) (H^) goes to qy, then H^ (H^) goes to qy and loops so qn was the right answer.

*The strawman deception is all that you have*
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Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hq0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hqy ∞ // Ĥ applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩ halts
Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hq0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hqn   // Ĥ applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩ does not halt
∀Ĥ.H (Ĥ.H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ != Halts(⟨Ĥ⟩, ⟨Ĥ⟩))
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*The answer must come from elements of the above set*
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 Nope. Not the requirement
 That woould be asking which H was correct, which IS an invalid question

*Yes you are finally getting this*
Feb 20, 2015, 11:38:48 AM sci.lang
The logical law of polar questions
When posed to a man whom has never been married,
the question: Have you stopped beating your wife?
Is an incorrect polar question because neither yes nor
no is a correct answer.
Thus any H that has both of its answers contradicted
cannot possibly correctly answer that question...

(since it has a false premise, that one of them is correct).
 How do you parse the question:
"Does the Machine described by your input Halt?" into you set of choices>
 Remember, that part of the proof you are quoting was under the presumption that there existed a correct H, so when you arrive at a contradiction, the solution is that presumption was false.

--
Copyright 2024 Olcott "Talent hits a target no one else can hit; Genius
hits a target no one else can see." Arthur Schopenhauer