Re: Proof that H(D,D) meets its abort criteria --incorrect question instance--

On 3/20/24 2:17 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/20/2024 1:00 PM, Richard Damon wrote:

On 3/19/24 2:53 PM, olcott wrote:

On 3/19/2024 1:31 PM, immibis wrote:

On 19/03/24 19:14, olcott wrote:

On 3/19/2024 12:42 PM, immibis wrote:

On 19/03/24 05:37, olcott wrote:

You are just getting nutty now. You are tossing out the sequence, selection, iteration model of computation.

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aren't you tossing out the turing machine model of computation?
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I am only tossing out the halting problem specification.
I am not saying (like Richard is saying) that sequential
code can be executed out-of-sequence.
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in other words you accept the halting problem is unsolvable and want to work on a different problem instead.

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Incorrect questions are questions defined to have no correct
answer. Is this sentence true or false: "This sentence is not true."
Is a concrete example of an incorrect question. A less subtle example
is this question: Is this sentence true or false: "What time is it?"

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Right, but "Does the machine described by your input Halt?"
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DOES have a correct answer (just not the one that this H gives) so it is a CORRECT question.
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Incorrect question instances are questions defined to have no correct
answer when posed to a specific entity.  They may have correct answers
when posed to a different entity.

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And the fact that the entity DOESN'T give the correct answer doesn't make the question incorrect.
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 Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hq0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hqy ∞ // Ĥ applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩ halts
Ĥ.q0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hq0 ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⊢* Ĥ.Hqn   // Ĥ applied to ⟨Ĥ⟩ does not halt
 When neither YES no NO is a correct answer when posed to
Ĥ.H ⟨Ĥ⟩ ⟨Ĥ⟩ of the above template then this is an incorrect
question instance.

No, if the particular H / H^.H says Yes, then NO is the correct answer, and if the particular H / H^.H says No, then Yes is the correct answer.
A given H / H^.H can only give one answer.
You are just admittting you are totally ignorant of how Programs work.

 

Can Carol correctly answer “no” to this [yes/no] question?
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In the case of Hehner's "twisted self-reference" incorrect question
  instances can be understood to be incorrect questions when the
  full context of who is asked is included in the meaning of the question.

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Which, since you admit he CHANGES the question, his arguement fails to be valid based on using the STRAWMAN fallacy.
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It does not change the question. We are simply examining the subset cases when the question is applied to specific decider/input pairs.

But, that means that each pair is part of a DIFFERENT question, each of which can have a different answer.
The fact that NONE of your selected H's get the right answer for the input you have happened to pair them with shows that NONE of them are correct deciders.
The fact that for every one of your Hs, there exists another decider, H1, that gets the right answer to the question, means that BY DEFINITION, there IS a correct answer, so the question is not incorrect.

 When posed to every entity named "Carol"
the question is an {incorrect question instance}.
 

Which is a strawman, as "Carol" is a volitional being, who can get whatever answer she wants, while the decider is a deterministic algorithm for which its answer to the question was predetermined when it was written.
Something you seem unable to understand, making me wonder if you have sold your "free-will" to the devil for something, and are now trying to break out of your deterministic life by trying to redefine determinism to include free-will abilities.