Re: the notion of counter-intuitiveness in relativistic physics

Le 07/08/2024 à 17:58, hitlong@yahoo.com (gharnagel) a écrit :

On Wed, 7 Aug 2024 14:44:15 +0000, Richard Hachel wrote:

>
Le 07/08/2024 à 16:25, hitlong@yahoo.com (gharnagel) a écrit :

>
Hmm, doesn't look like a laugh.  Maybe an OMG!  Meaning, you just
realized that Jan is right.  Well, maybe a laugh would be appropriate,
too, meaning "how could I have been so wrong!"
>
You come up with your D'=D.sqrt[(1+Vo/c)/(1-Vo/c)], which isn't length
contraction but Doppler shift, which is dependent on the sign of your
Vo.  LC is NOT so dependent.  It would be a VERY strange universe if
it were.

>
You say: "it's a Doppler shift".
And for sqrt(1-Vo²/c²)?
Isn't it a Doppler shift?
Yes, it's also a Doppler shift.

 The classical Doppler shift is lambda' = lambda/(1 +/- v).  The
relativistic
Doppler equation is lambda' = lambda sqrt(1 - v^2/c^2)/(1 +/- v/c). Which,
of course, is lambda' = lambda sqrt[(1 - v/c)/(1 + v/c) for approaching
and
lambda' = lambda sqrt[(1 + v/c)/(1 - v/c) for receding.

 Yes.
 Absolutely.

 

This is what Hachel calls the "internal Doppler effect".

 It is not a distance effect, and definitely not LC.
 

Relativists call it the transverse Doppler effect, but the term is
neither fair nor pretty.

 Nope.  The transverse Doppler effect is simply time dilation.  Your
equation has longitudinal Doppler built into it.

I'm not talking about that.
I'm talking about the WORD.
The word transverse is inappropriate. It is used to say that it is the only effect that remains if the movement is transverse, but it is very inappropriate because the effect exists in all directions, and it is constant whatever the direction.
This term is neither precise nor beautiful.
The term Internal Doppler Effect seems much more logical and appropriate to me, because it is an internal effect to the reciprocal speed of the two frames of reference.

 

The longitudinal Doppler effect is already a relativistic effect.

 Nope.

 Mais bordel, vous allez être poli, oui?  Je vous dis, bordel de merde, que :
 The longitudinal Doppler effect is already a relativistic effect.
 Franchement le comportement de certains commence à me casser les couilles.
 Mais merde!!!
 Répondez moi que ce n'est pas ce que dis la théorie, mais ne me dites pas que ce que je dis n'est pas vrai ou que je me trompe.
 Ce comportement est intolérable. 

 

When Römer observes the moons of Jupiter, his measurements are correct:
but he will say: "When you cut a dog's legs, it no longer comes when you
hit its bowl to eat: cutting a dog's legs affects its eardrums".
I would prefer that we speak of internal Doppler effect, and external
Doppler effect. The terms would be more accurate.

 Nope.  There are only longitudinal and transverse.

  MERDE !!!
  Putain, il faut des nerfs.
 R.H.